OUT WITH FITTING IN

[TRAV]

   http://godplace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25749.0

Reflection:

Being a single guy there is the challenge of defining oneself. I believe it is a continuing evolution.
I was thinking about the term "typical Pentecostal" after seeing the video above. It made me feel awkward. It seemed like a step backward. Even the music was a step backward. Although, being Apostolic has been a major part of my life, I'm not sure I fit into this mold (the one in the video) very well.
I feel I am outside of the box already. I try not to care about others perceptions, although I remain sensitive. Often, I feel like an outsider, yet I want to be a part of what's happening. Maybe the reason I don't always connect is because I grew up in a Pentecostal home, but not in a Pentecostal culture.

Have you ever asked yourself: What is it that I really want to be part of? Who or what defines me?

I always felt I would redefine what it means to be a part of the UPC. In some ways, I feel I have but now I lean toward Jesus redefining me, which seems a bit more personal and difficult. I only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.

[sunlight]

I only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.

I know how you feel. I'm glad you posted this...
~ Chel

[Chinadoll]

All the time Trav.

I'm not a typical Pentecostal gal.  Never have been.   Never will be.    I like wearing my long hair straight and prefer comfort over style

but it's beyond that.  If you read my poems or writings -- Daily Armour or A Rock Named Manssah --  my sister is the Pentecostal Princess while I struggle to sit through a ladies meeting feeling like they don't even hit what's in my life.   I'm not uncomfortable being a woman but I can be uncomfortable being THIS woman.

I'm me.  I'm not my sister and I'm not every other woman in Pentecost.

I'm me and that's who God made me to be.   And my pastor told me a long time ago "I don't like cookie cutters"

Thank God for that.

Nai

[MelodyB]

I am not a POPCICLE!

Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. 

[TRAV]

I am not a POPCICLE!

[MelodyB]

I am not a POPCICLE!

Popcicles are shaped into a mold, and they all look the same, and are all the same.

The Bible says....Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world

My Pastor preached on that a while back ago and related it to being a Popcicle...so we picked up the phrase.."I am not a Popscicle"

[Nerd]

It has to go so much further than just the organization.

Almost makes it seem like the same stereotyping kids had back in school. "What are you, in a word?"

[SippinTea]

Almost makes it seem like the same stereotyping kids had back in school. "What are you, in a word?"

Hadn't thought of it that way before....but yeah, that's exactly what it feels like sometimes. 

now I lean toward Jesus redefining me, which seems a bit more personal and difficult. I only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.

Nicely said.

[newkris]

and this topic, my friends, is what's going to change the face of the Pentecostal culture in the future.  if the doctrine and teachings we believe have a Biblical foundation (which i believe they do) then we have to evolve and change to bring that message to the world.  it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.

good stuff, youse guys, good stuff. 

i'm learning more and more about letting Jesus define me. 

[zizi90]

  http://godplace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25749.0

Reflection:

I feel I am outside of the box already. I try not to care about others perceptions, although I remain sensitive. Often, I feel like an outsider, yet I want to be a part of what's happening. Maybe the reason I don't always connect is because I grew up in a Pentecostal home, but not in a Pentecostal culture.

Aaaamen. Completely know where you're coming from, and my brother and I have discussed this more times than I can count.

[InChristGirl]

I'm back from oblivion for a lil' while.....This place can really get a grip on ya'.

Anyway............."Out with fitting in" Yes! I completely agree!
I've never fit into the "typical" UPC mold and I don't think I ever will.
My Church being an Indie church I was never "forced" into it to begin with, but we had and still have a lot of contact/fellowship with UPC churches. I can confess that most if not all the time I've felt very.......what's the word.......sloppy....unpolished..subpar..compaired to the other youth in those churches. I may disappoint some but I just can't put 2 hours into getting ready for church Sundays and Wednesdays week in and week out! I've got a life, and I can't afford to waste it in front of the mirror for that long. Plus it takes all the talent in body just to braid my hair

The other thing that really, I mean really bothers me is the cavalier way that many take dating. I will confess that at nearly 22 I have never dated in my life Big shocker I'm sure
Whether it's dating in the world or dating in the church it all ways leaves behind a trail of broken hearts and severed relationships.

Anyway that was my rant.......sorry. Continue as you were

[alohilani]

if the doctrine and teachings we believe have a Biblical foundation (which i believe they do) then we have to evolve and change to bring that message to the world.  it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.

Well said!

[terp]

it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.

...with respect to the ministers and foundation/tradition layers.  I'm all for letting Jesus define me, but sometimes that takes place in obedience to authority and what they've established (holding to some things); being grounded in foundation or tradition while being free in relationship.

I'm playing devil's advocate (so to speak) because I've seen people very close to me think they were changing the face of Pentecost and ended up changing their doctrine out of disobedience and bitterness to those in authority.  Not a place I'd like to be. 

Just my two cents.  Smile. 

[terp]

I just can't put 2 hours into getting ready for church Sundays and Wednesdays week in and week out! I've got a life, and I can't afford to waste it in front of the mirror for that long.

the cavalier way that many take dating. 

I have a feeling those who do find the time to engage in either of these have deeper issues than just being Pentecostal.  Just a thought...

[zizi90]

I may disappoint some but I just can't put 2 hours into getting ready for church Sundays and Wednesdays week in and week out! I've got a life, and I can't afford to waste it in front of the mirror for that long

But Sarah, what else are you going to do for those two hours before church on Sunday mornings...sleep or something?



LOL JK

[apsurf]

I have never fit in no matter where I was-from the time I was a kid, I was never in the "IN" crowd, or in the "OUT" crowd for that matter....I usually ended up hanging with the kids everyone rejected.  My best friend in HS had down syndrome.  Come to think of it, he was more popular than I was!

As for the church, I ended up fitting in better with the methodist then I have the apostolic ranks....
But I am my own person... I have tried to accomodate others for so long, now it is time to completely be me, not just what others want me to be...

[terp]

Who determines "IN" and "OUT"?

[apsurf]

society, culture,

hmmm....


and me!

[SippinTea]

it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.

...with respect to the ministers and foundation/tradition layers.  I'm all for letting Jesus define me, but sometimes that takes place in obedience to authority and what they've established (holding to some things); being grounded in foundation or tradition while being free in relationship.

I'm playing devil's advocate (so to speak) because I've seen people very close to me think they were changing the face of Pentecost and ended up changing their doctrine out of disobedience and bitterness to those in authority.  Not a place I'd like to be. 

Just my two cents.  Smile. 

You go, Girl!  

Somewhere there's a balance between hanging on to the legacy that's been handed down to us, and letting go of those things which could prove to do more harm than good. It seems to me, that when people start moving a fence-line it's often nothing to do with the issue itself, it's all about proving they _can_. Not okay. The men and women who have gone before us were (for the most part, I believe) sincere and prayerfully did their best to leave a safe trail for those of us coming along behind them. If we're wanting to change the fence-posts, we'd better know why they were placed where they were before we get too radical with change.

My two cents + your two cents = 4 sense

[MelodyB]

You go, Girl!  

Somewhere there's a balance between hanging on to the legacy that's been handed down to us, and letting go of those things which could prove to do more harm than good. It seems to me, that when people start moving a fence-line it's often nothing to do with the issue itself, it's all about proving they _can_. Not okay. The men and women who have gone before us were (for the most part, I believe) sincere and prayerfully did their best to leave a safe trail for those of us coming along behind them. If we're wanting to change the fence-posts, we'd better know why they were placed where they were before we get too radical with change.

My two cents + your two cents = 4 sense

[TRAV]

Who determines "IN" and "OUT"?

I think it has something to do with the doctor when you're born....

[WillofGod1970]

I am most definately an outsider. I grew up a Methodist and became an Apostolic when i was 23. Never been into the cookie cutter crowd and i don't care about what peoples perceptions of me are. What i do care about is God's perception of me and my relationship with him. God made me who i am and gave me my qualities. So if that is fitting in then i'm all for it, otherwise, being an outsider is awesome and i'm proud to be one. Glory to God!!!

[newkris]

it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.

...with respect to the ministers and foundation/tradition layers.  I'm all for letting Jesus define me, but sometimes that takes place in obedience to authority and what they've established (holding to some things); being grounded in foundation or tradition while being free in relationship.

I'm playing devil's advocate (so to speak) because I've seen people very close to me think they were changing the face of Pentecost and ended up changing their doctrine out of disobedience and bitterness to those in authority.  Not a place I'd like to be. 

Just my two cents.  Smile. 

You go, Girl!  

Somewhere there's a balance between hanging on to the legacy that's been handed down to us, and letting go of those things which could prove to do more harm than good. It seems to me, that when people start moving a fence-line it's often nothing to do with the issue itself, it's all about proving they _can_. Not okay. The men and women who have gone before us were (for the most part, I believe) sincere and prayerfully did their best to leave a safe trail for those of us coming along behind them. If we're wanting to change the fence-posts, we'd better know why they were placed where they were before we get too radical with change.

My two cents + your two cents = 4 sense

i totally agree, girls.  i think there's a lot of harm done by "reformers" who throw the baby out with the bathwater.  they are trying so hard to change what they see as tradition, that they destroy a lot of things that they ought to have kept.  

similarly, it's important to make sure that the fenceposts that we hold on to are really those that matter to God.  what exactly does He expect of us?  i think, honestly, that if we are sincerely seeking to serve Him, we are able to find a balance between what is necessary as a follower and what is not.  how we represent Him innerly-and-outerly becomes natural if we are focused on Him and not on what someone else expects of us.  

following your example, terp, having a foundation of bitterness is clearly not innerly acceptable to Him.  until the bitterness is fixed, all the other actions are just . .  .fluff.  know what i mean?  the real problem isn't moving the fenceposts, it's avoiding the bitterness.

as i have said before, one of the most challenging things about raising kids in the church was to help them find a way to be followers of Christ and not just "pentecostal."  in retrospect, i think i did okay. 

[SippinTea]

as i have said before, one of the most challenging things about raising kids in the church was to help them find a way to be followers of Christ and not just "pentecostal."  in retrospect, i think i did okay. 

If your boys are as much like you-know-who as you say they are.... Yeah, you did an awesome job. 

[newkris]

as much like who?  i don't know who . . .  .