:lurk: http://godplace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25749.0 (http://godplace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25749.0)
Reflection:
Being a single guy there is the challenge of defining oneself. I believe it is a continuing evolution.
I was thinking about the term "typical Pentecostal" after seeing the video above. It made me feel awkward. It seemed like a step backward. Even the music was a step backward. Although, being Apostolic has been a major part of my life, I'm not sure I fit into this mold (the one in the video) very well.
I feel I am outside of the box already. I try not to care about others perceptions, although I remain sensitive. Often, I feel like an outsider, yet I want to be a part of what's happening. Maybe the reason I don't always connect is because I grew up in a Pentecostal home, but not in a Pentecostal culture.
Have you ever asked yourself: What is it that I really want to be part of? Who or what defines me?
I always felt I would redefine what it means to be a part of the UPC. In some ways, I feel I have but now I lean toward Jesus redefining me, which seems a bit more personal and difficult. I only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.
QuoteI only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.
I know how you feel. I'm glad you posted this...
~ Chel
All the time Trav.
I'm not a typical Pentecostal gal. Never have been. Never will be. I like wearing my long hair straight and prefer comfort over style
but it's beyond that. If you read my poems or writings -- Daily Armour or A Rock Named Manssah -- my sister is the Pentecostal Princess while I struggle to sit through a ladies meeting feeling like they don't even hit what's in my life. I'm not uncomfortable being a woman but I can be uncomfortable being THIS woman.
I'm me. I'm not my sister and I'm not every other woman in Pentecost.
I'm me and that's who God made me to be. And my pastor told me a long time ago "I don't like cookie cutters"
Thank God for that.
Nai
I am not a POPCICLE!
Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Quote from: TRAV on June 29, 2007, 03:48:36 AM
Quote from: Mel-Mel on June 28, 2007, 11:25:35 PM
I am not a POPCICLE!
:think:
Popcicles are shaped into a mold, and they all look the same, and are all the same.
The Bible says....Rom 12:2 And be not
conformed to this world
My Pastor preached on that a while back ago and related it to being a Popcicle...so we picked up the phrase.."I am not a Popscicle"
It has to go so much further than just the organization.
Almost makes it seem like the same stereotyping kids had back in school. "What are you, in a word?"
Quote from: coolguy on June 29, 2007, 04:58:50 AM
Almost makes it seem like the same stereotyping kids had back in school. "What are you, in a word?"
Hadn't thought of it that way before....but yeah, that's exactly what it feels like sometimes. :smirk2:
Quote from: TRAV on June 28, 2007, 03:38:14 PM
now I lean toward Jesus redefining me, which seems a bit more personal and difficult. I only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.
Nicely said.
:beret:
and this topic, my friends, is what's going to change the face of the Pentecostal culture in the future. if the doctrine and teachings we believe have a Biblical foundation (which i believe they do) then we have to evolve and change to bring that message to the world. it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.
good stuff, youse guys, good stuff.
i'm learning more and more about letting Jesus define me.
Quote from: TRAV on June 28, 2007, 03:38:14 PM
:lurk: http://godplace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25749.0 (http://godplace.com/forum/index.php?topic=25749.0)
Reflection:
I feel I am outside of the box already. I try not to care about others perceptions, although I remain sensitive. Often, I feel like an outsider, yet I want to be a part of what's happening. Maybe the reason I don't always connect is because I grew up in a Pentecostal home, but not in a Pentecostal culture.
Aaaamen. Completely know where you're coming from, and my brother and I have discussed this more times than I can count.
I'm back from oblivion for a lil' while.....This place can really get a grip on ya'.
Anyway............."Out with fitting in" Yes! I completely agree!
I've never fit into the "typical" UPC mold and I don't think I ever will.
My Church being an Indie church I was never "forced" into it to begin with, but we had and still have a lot of contact/fellowship with UPC churches. I can confess that most if not all the time I've felt very.......what's the word.......sloppy....unpolished..subpar..compaired to the other youth in those churches. I may disappoint some but I just can't put 2 hours into getting ready for church Sundays and Wednesdays week in and week out! I've got a life, and I can't afford to waste it in front of the mirror for that long. :tantrum: Plus it takes all the talent in body just to braid my hair :pound:
The other thing that really, I mean really bothers me is the cavalier way that many take dating. I will confess that at nearly 22 I have never dated in my life :o Big shocker I'm sure :roll:
Whether it's dating in the world or dating in the church it all ways leaves behind a trail of broken hearts and severed relationships.
Anyway that was my rant.......sorry. Continue as you were :hypocrite:
Quote from: newkris on June 29, 2007, 12:53:44 PM
if the doctrine and teachings we believe have a Biblical foundation (which i believe they do) then we have to evolve and change to bring that message to the world. it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.
Well said!
Quote from: newkris on June 29, 2007, 12:53:44 PM
it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.
...with respect to the ministers and foundation/tradition layers. I'm all for letting Jesus define me, but sometimes that takes place in obedience to authority and what they've established (holding to some things); being grounded in foundation or tradition while being free in relationship.
I'm playing devil's advocate (so to speak) because I've seen people very close to me think they were changing the face of Pentecost and ended up changing their doctrine out of disobedience and bitterness to those in authority. Not a place I'd like to be.
Just my two cents. Smile.
Quote from: InChristGirl on June 30, 2007, 03:05:11 AM
I just can't put 2 hours into getting ready for church Sundays and Wednesdays week in and week out! I've got a life, and I can't afford to waste it in front of the mirror for that long.
the cavalier way that many take dating.
I have a feeling those who do find the time to engage in either of these have deeper issues than just being Pentecostal. Just a thought... ;)
Quote from: InChristGirl on June 30, 2007, 03:05:11 AM
I may disappoint some but I just can't put 2 hours into getting ready for church Sundays and Wednesdays week in and week out! I've got a life, and I can't afford to waste it in front of the mirror for that long
But Sarah, what else are you going to do for those two hours before church on Sunday mornings...sleep or something?
LOL JK
I have never fit in no matter where I was-from the time I was a kid, I was never in the "IN" crowd, or in the "OUT" crowd for that matter....I usually ended up hanging with the kids everyone rejected. My best friend in HS had down syndrome. Come to think of it, he was more popular than I was!
As for the church, I ended up fitting in better with the methodist then I have the apostolic ranks....
But I am my own person... I have tried to accomodate others for so long, now it is time to completely be me, not just what others want me to be...
Who determines "IN" and "OUT"?
society, culture,
hmmm....
and me! :P :laughhard:
Quote from: terp on June 30, 2007, 11:51:21 AM
Quote from: newkris on June 29, 2007, 12:53:44 PM
it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.
...with respect to the ministers and foundation/tradition layers. I'm all for letting Jesus define me, but sometimes that takes place in obedience to authority and what they've established (holding to some things); being grounded in foundation or tradition while being free in relationship.
I'm playing devil's advocate (so to speak) because I've seen people very close to me think they were changing the face of Pentecost and ended up changing their doctrine out of disobedience and bitterness to those in authority. Not a place I'd like to be.
Just my two cents. Smile.
You go, Girl! :) :thumbsup2:
Somewhere there's a balance between hanging on to the legacy that's been handed down to us, and letting go of those things which could prove to do more harm than good. It seems to me, that when people start moving a fence-line it's often nothing to do with the issue itself, it's all about proving they _can_. Not okay. The men and women who have gone before us were (for the most part, I believe) sincere and prayerfully did their best to leave a safe trail for those of us coming along behind them. If we're wanting to change the fence-posts, we'd better know why they were placed where they were before we get too radical with change.
My two cents + your two cents = 4 sense ;)
:beret:
Quote from: SippinTea on June 30, 2007, 04:21:39 PM
You go, Girl! :) :thumbsup2:
Somewhere there's a balance between hanging on to the legacy that's been handed down to us, and letting go of those things which could prove to do more harm than good. It seems to me, that when people start moving a fence-line it's often nothing to do with the issue itself, it's all about proving they _can_. Not okay. The men and women who have gone before us were (for the most part, I believe) sincere and prayerfully did their best to leave a safe trail for those of us coming along behind them. If we're wanting to change the fence-posts, we'd better know why they were placed where they were before we get too radical with change.
My two cents + your two cents = 4 sense ;)
:beret:
:thumbsup2:
Quote from: terp on June 30, 2007, 12:51:50 PM
Who determines "IN" and "OUT"?
I think it has something to do with the doctor when you're born....
I am most definately an outsider. I grew up a Methodist and became an Apostolic when i was 23. Never been into the cookie cutter crowd and i don't care about what peoples perceptions of me are. What i do care about is God's perception of me and my relationship with him. God made me who i am and gave me my qualities. So if that is fitting in then i'm all for it, otherwise, being an outsider is awesome and i'm proud to be one. Glory to God!!! :thumbsup2:
Quote from: SippinTea on June 30, 2007, 04:21:39 PM
Quote from: terp on June 30, 2007, 11:51:21 AM
Quote from: newkris on June 29, 2007, 12:53:44 PM
it's not about being a "religion"and holding to one thing or another culturally, it's about living for Jesus.
...with respect to the ministers and foundation/tradition layers. I'm all for letting Jesus define me, but sometimes that takes place in obedience to authority and what they've established (holding to some things); being grounded in foundation or tradition while being free in relationship.
I'm playing devil's advocate (so to speak) because I've seen people very close to me think they were changing the face of Pentecost and ended up changing their doctrine out of disobedience and bitterness to those in authority. Not a place I'd like to be.
Just my two cents. Smile.
You go, Girl! :) :thumbsup2:
Somewhere there's a balance between hanging on to the legacy that's been handed down to us, and letting go of those things which could prove to do more harm than good. It seems to me, that when people start moving a fence-line it's often nothing to do with the issue itself, it's all about proving they _can_. Not okay. The men and women who have gone before us were (for the most part, I believe) sincere and prayerfully did their best to leave a safe trail for those of us coming along behind them. If we're wanting to change the fence-posts, we'd better know why they were placed where they were before we get too radical with change.
My two cents + your two cents = 4 sense ;)
:beret:
i totally agree, girls. i think there's a lot of harm done by "reformers" who throw the baby out with the bathwater. they are trying so hard to change what they see as tradition, that they destroy a lot of things that they ought to have kept.
similarly, it's important to make sure that the fenceposts that we hold on to are really those that matter to God. what exactly does He expect of us? i think, honestly, that if we are sincerely seeking to serve Him, we are able to find a balance between what is necessary as a follower and what is not. how we represent Him innerly-and-outerly becomes natural if we are focused on Him and not on what someone else expects of us.
following your example, terp, having a foundation of bitterness is clearly not innerly acceptable to Him. until the bitterness is fixed, all the other actions are just . . .fluff. know what i mean? the real problem isn't moving the fenceposts, it's avoiding the bitterness.
as i have said before, one of the most challenging things about raising kids in the church was to help them find a way to be followers of Christ and not just "pentecostal." in retrospect, i think i did okay.
Quote from: newkris on July 05, 2007, 02:52:16 AM
as i have said before, one of the most challenging things about raising kids in the church was to help them find a way to be followers of Christ and not just "pentecostal." in retrospect, i think i did okay.
If your boys are as much like you-know-who as you say they are.... Yeah, you did an awesome job. :thumbsup2:
:pwink:
:beret:
as much like who? i don't know who . . . . ???
Like CB. ;)
:beret:
Quote from: WillofGod1970 on July 05, 2007, 02:49:12 AM
What i do care about is God's perception of me and my relationship with him.
Amen. I agree on that one 150%!
Some people define themselves as the position they are in. For example:
I am a preacher
I am a musician
I am a teacher, etc.
How do you define yourself? :sofachair:
Im a dork!
MEL!! What have I told you about that? :mad:
*hug* You're not a dork.
:beret:
I knew you would see that....
Ok...
I ACT dorky most times.
Better?
Much. ;)
:beret:
Quote from: TRAV on July 07, 2007, 08:50:16 PM
Some people define themselves as the position they are in. For example:
I am a preacher
I am a musician
I am a teacher, etc.
How do you define yourself? :sofachair:
here's new ground for me . . .
i WAS someone's mom, someone's secretary, someone's teacher
i AM
a follower of Christ
a mom, bapka and friend - to many
a student
a writer
what character traits to you ascribe to yourself?
I am me
....
Edit..............Waaaaaaay too much whining.......
sorry ya'll :-\
....
I am really thankful to have friends that put up with me when I'm like this
I am in dire need of a real hug
Quote from: Amelia Bedelia on July 08, 2007, 04:35:36 PM
I am me
I am in dire need of a real hug
Well, well, don't worry your pretty little head about it any longer. You got yourself a HUG.
*HUGS* Amelia because she sho nuff needs a good one right about now. mm mm
Put that worried look away and stop yer shakin'. Everything is gonna be alright.
:thumbsup2:
*hugs* and prays. wish i was there, kiddo . . .
*HUGS* thanks you two
I am... a bit better now : )
I just got back from seeing my little brother for the first time in too long and got to hug him too - overgrown, scruffy, sweaty thing that he is (working outdoors on a very hot day poor thing)
Hmmmm.
interesting. :pwink:
Fascinating!
Quote from: terp on June 30, 2007, 12:51:50 PM
Who determines "IN" and "OUT"?
Seems like whenever a topic like this comes up everyone writes in with how they don't fit in, aren't cookie cutter, don't belong etc.
There have been so many times I felt like the odd one out, didn't belong etc. looking at someone else thinking how much they did fit in... and several times I've later talked to the person I thought was so "in" and found out they were feeling the same way in reverse towards me! Nothing like being open and honest... you can find out so many things and make so much more meaningful connections with people when you bring down the facades LOL
Where do these molds truly come from? Does anyone ever actually feel like they fit in any of them? And if they do, are they happy with them - or are they only trying to fit in a mold because they feel pressured as well? Do we (the "outsiders") ever inadverntently perpetuate these molds?
1 Corinthians 3:9
For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
Bricks work better when they're of similar size and shape. Huey Lewis said it best, "It's Hip To Be Square"
I used to be a renegade, I used to fool around
But I couldnt take the punishment, and had to settle down
Now Im playing it real straight, and yes I cut my hair
You might think Im crazy, but I dont even care
Because I can tell whats going on
Its hip to be square
Quote from: TRAV on June 28, 2007, 03:38:14 PM
I only ask that Jesus would make me more authentically His. I hope I can handle it. No joke.
[/color]
When faced with similar struggles Job offers us an excellent answer and displays a spirit that is pleasing to God.
Job 13:15
Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him
Dood
you just quoted:
the Apostle Paul
Huey Lewis
and Job
in two consecutive posts......LOL
I admit I'm no forum veteran... is quoting not cool? I know here in the Bible Belt people can get upset if you start talking about what the Bible says without offering chapter and verse to back it up.
how about WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO you quoted......... :great:....Mr. Bible Belter. I have only heard of a place called the Bible Belt. Never been a part of it. Probably a good thing.
Well, I included Mr. Lewis's comments mainly to add a little humor, you know, lighten it up a bit... I mean, don't tell me you can't feel a little tingle when you hear the intro to that song... come on, lol! Besides, I think the man deserves a little credit for encouraging people to clean up their appearance, stop abusing drugs and alcohol, and get a job. :twocents:
As far as the Bible Belt goes... yeah, there's a truth-teaching church every 5-10 miles, but there's a false prophet on every-other corner... and they've ALL got Bibles. :smirk2:
Pentecostals fit in yet they feel they stand out.
They desire to NOT be part of the IN crowd yet they run like lemmings to the latest trends in Pentecostal fashion and they subscribe to the latest in entertainment trends.
Many times we all look the same but we want, individually, to be ...well...individuals.
I think in many ways we are all like the world, we are just not of it.
Hmmmm........deep......and_interesting
everyone wants to belong to the group, to not be excluded.
in our own individual way, of course.
I live in the country. Out here when an animal is preparing to die from disease or old age it'll go into the woods alone, or otherwise seperate itself from 'the pack'. Not sure how this fits but it seems relevant.
Everyone seeks validation, I think. We all want approval and acceptance and sometimes we'll compromise our individuality for it. Is that always a bad thing, though?
Interesting thoughts..
Romans 1:20
For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
maybe our innate desire to conform, to find SOMEONE to conform to, is proof of a Saviour? It's clear to see from what has been made that all men are looking for someone to immitate, a guide, etc. :idea:
Interesing read. I saw a "guest" reading this.
For some reason when I read the first post I heard Karen Harding singing "Classical Pentecostal" in my head.