The Biblical Definition of Heresy

[Messenger]

After reading so many different opinions by Christians in many venues, about what constitutes heresy, I am starting to wonder if anyone really knows just what are the signs of real heresy. Not groups with different opinions, but what constitutes real heresy. Or does anyone really know? In other words, what is the difference between heresy, and a Christian simply holding a different doctrine than the majority Church?

I know it's a difficult question, so give it some thought and tell me what you think is the dividing line between heresy and someone simply holding an erroneous Church opinion. Thanks!

[Scott]

Hmmmmm

[onli-one-jehovi]

The only use of "heresy" I could find in the Word occurs in Acts 24. The Jews say that Paul's beliefs are "heresy". Paul confessed to only believing all the words found in the Law & Prophets; ie the Word of God.

Looks to me like biblical heresy applies to spiritual doctrine not found in the scriptures or any distortion to that. {Jesus told us not to add or subtract from the Word.}

Thus IF the majority of the recognized church does not teach & live the whole Word of God; choosing instead to add carnal doctrine and interpretations, - they would be guilty of biblical heresy.

Differing opinions usually come about due to level of knowledge/understanding in a person's walk. We see thru a glass darkly until full revelation comes.

I think that once a person see's & understands biblical truth, they must make a choice to accept or reject. It's one thing to not understand. Something else entirely to reject it. Rejectors are then biblical heretics as far as I understand.

[Melody]

heresies is found 3 other times in the NT.  all 4 are 139 in the strongs.  But that definition isn't terribly descriptive.

[onli-one-jehovi]

heresies is found 3 other times in the NT.  all 4 are 139 in the strongs.  But that definition isn't terribly descriptive.

yeah, i saw that too. i was replying from work and just shot off the cuff. looked things up at home.

"Heresy" is found once in Acts 24. "heresies" found 3 other times. The Strongs listing covers 139-142 and comes out as choice, pulling away, or something along those lines. Going from memory here.

  Acts 24:14   But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:


  1 Corinthians 11:19   For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

  Galatians 5:20   Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

  2 Peter 2:1   But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

If we read the verses prior to and after the above listed; we find some clues to the biblical meaning of "heresy".

Acts 24 - Paul goes on to state the matter is about the resurrection of the dead. The gospel is founded upon the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ Jesus. The OT Church {under the law} found the gospel to be "heresy" for departing from established beliefs.

Galatians 5 - Heresies is included in the warning written to the church defining works of the flesh. We must be sure to be led of the Holy Spirit and not the flesh.

1 Corinthians 11 - The warning of divisions being among the church before meetings. Paul goes on to clarify the proper method of partaking of the Lord's Supper. He chastizes the church for not discerning the Lord's Body which includes rich and poor alike. We are not supposed to have respect of persons.

2 Peter - We see that scripture is of no private or separate interpretation. We can't choose a meaning we like.

Heresy involves choosing or pulling away from scripture in support of tradition, or fleshly desires. Over the past 1700 yrs of darkness, - while the Body was buried in the earth - there has been much "heresy" inserted into the Church. Since we've physically entered the 3rd day of resurrection, the LORD is turning His people back to the Word and away from Babylon's influence. Thus the call to come out and be separate resonates so loudly within those with ears to hear and eyes to see.

Scripture tells us that in the last days there would be a famine of hearing the Word of God. Those with itching ears will choose to remain in what the Bible defines as heresy and not be allowed into the kingdom of God.

[onli-one-jehovi]

Cleared too soon...

Look for and expect to be called "heretic" for believing and adhering strictly to the Word of God and the leading of the Holy Ghost rather than following religious doctrines.

[dnr1128]

Usually heretical beliefs are those which fall outside the mainstream of Christianity at that given time.

[Messenger]

Interesting answers. I think what was said is right on the mark about the scriptures being of no private (personal) interpretation, that people could believe whatever they personally wanted or whatever seems right in their own eyes.

  2 Peter 2:1   But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Aren't there many ways to deny Christ besides verbal? False teachers are those who reject the truth of the Word and teach whatever they want. These false teachers with their lips praise God, but in their actions they deny Him.

It has been said that heresies (being errors in departing from the word) are unavoidable, as everyone doesn't have 100% of all doctrines correctly. But damnable heresies are by definition false doctrines taught by people, that lead to damnation. Doctrines such as the people who told Christ that He had a devil because He cast out devils. Or false doctrines such as man ruling in the temple as if he was God. In other words, not just wrong doctrines, but unconscionable doctrines that lead people to depart from the faith, being seduced by the spirit of the flesh.

1 Timothy 4:1  Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Doctrines of devils are Heretical doctrines. Does this not speak of an apostasy, or a departing from the faith once embraced by the Church? Where the people turn apostates in their giving heed, not to the word of God as doctrine, but to impostures with doctrines of men. Men coming bringing their private interpretations into the Church. In a word, Heresy. Would you agree or disagree?

[onli-one-jehovi]

"Aren't there many ways to deny Christ besides verbal? False teachers are those who reject the truth of the Word and teach whatever they want. These false teachers with their lips praise God, but in their actions they deny Him."

True, but the real danger is found among the people who refuse to search the scriptures for themselves. Most of the Church - real & professed - depend upon the pulpit for instruction and interpretation. Easy prey to fall into heresies.

Damnable heresies are those deceits so close to truth as to be almost indistinguishable. Indistinguishable via the flesh though. Only in the Spirit do such things become clear.

Yeah, we can never get rid of all of them. We're constantly in a state of revelation. What I understand today as "scriptural truth" can easily be identified as heresy tomorrow. It's my response to such things that makes the difference. It could well become "damnable" for me.

An honest and complete examination of what we personally believe and why, is needed - no -demanded at this time. If I discover an accepted practice in the Church to be "heresy" - having no clear backing in the Word of God - then I must cast it aside for truth. To continue observing such things makes it damnable due to an act of rebellion.

It's very easy for us to see the obvious things - Mary worship, homosexual priests, and such. But what about the things in our own denomination or congregation? Even our own personal convictions?

The hour is upon us and we must search the house for as much leaven as we can find. After all, heresy is an act of the flesh and we are supposed to put our flesh to death.

Good topic.

[Messenger]

Usually heretical beliefs are those which fall outside the mainstream of Christianity at that given time.

But heresies, at least those defined by scripture, don't change with the changing times or values of Christian society. Do you mean what people may call heresy at any given time, as opposed to actual heresy?

[Messenger]

True, but the real danger is found among the people who refuse to search the scriptures for themselves. Most of the Church - real & professed - depend upon the pulpit for instruction and interpretation. Easy prey to fall into heresies.

Amen. And the solution is to educate Christians concerning their own responsibilities, or rather witness to scriptures that encourage us all to study:

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

That we all, not simply Pastors, Teachers or other organized leaders, need to not be ashamed, because we have done as God commands and studied the scriptures diligently.

What I understand today as "scriptural truth" can easily be identified as heresy tomorrow. It's my response to such things that makes the difference. It could well become "damnable" for me.

You're the second person that said something like this, which I'll confess, I don't understand exactly what you mean. Could you elaborate? Thanks.

[onli-one-jehovi]

Let me start with a basic tenent of the Apostolic portion of the Body.

There was a time in my walk with Christ that I believed baptism in Father, Son, and Holy Ghost was biblically correct. The concept of baptism in Jesus' name was heretical. However, after searching the scriptures w/o a pre-determined conclusion, I found zero evidence of Mt 28:19 and multiples of Acts 2:38. I was now responsible to accept and be baptized or reject and be in rebellion.

That which was once "heresy" proved to be "truth", even though the majority of Christianity believes different.

Thus we must continually search the scriptures to see if what our denomination - in this case predominately Apostolic - teaches and observes is truly scriptural or heresy. Even the "sacred cows" have to be re-examined for veracity and not simply "following the crowd".

When Jesus commands us to come out and be separate, He is referring to the accepted "heresies" saturating the Church. All these are of Babylon or the flesh, and propagated mainly by the Nicolatian spirit which He hates. Since the Nicolatian is heretical, its doctrines can be no less.

Hope that makes sense.

[onli-one-jehovi]

Since we're talking about biblical heresy - here is an eye-opening article from www.preparehisway.com

NOT EVEN ONE VERSE?

Are you prepared for a shock?

These should be obvious, but the truth is the MAJORITY of Christians have swallowed many a lie.  How simple and easy it should be for a person who reads the Bible to see the obvious traditions and practices of Christianity which HAVE NOT A SINGLE VERSE to support them.

Yet the majority of Christians willingly accept the following as "Christian".   Many of these subjects are further developed in articles on this site.  In order to help you think in scriptural terms, here is a short list of unscriptural practices within apostate Christianity:

"add thou not unto His Word lest He reprove thee and thou be found a liar" "that ..ye might learn not to go beyond the things which are written; ..." -1Cor 4:6

*****************************************************************************************************************************************************************************************

It is impossible to show  these as a  verse or phrase in our Bibles:

1.  "Accept Christ as personal saviour"  spoken in scripture

2.  "ALTAR CALL" as a response to the gospel

3.  a. "Pastor": used as a formal title.  For example: "Pastor Smith",  "Pastor Larry" .....

     b. "Senior" Pastor, "Associate" Pastor, or "Assistant Pastor"
   
     c.  "Rabbi"  (Mat.23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your teacher, and all ye are brethren.

     d.  "Chaplain".  Have you ever read of one in your Bible?

4.  Any woman named in any TITLED position  (for example "Pastor Mary", "Prophetess Sue")  teaching or having authority over a man. (none of the named elders of scripture were women).
The Greek word for pastor is "poimen" a masculine noun.  You would never call a man a "prophetess" or a queen,  feminine nouns. The same applies for the office of "pastor", a masculine noun.

5.   "Service", "church service" "our service is at..."  as used to describe a gathering of Christians

6.    female angels. (whoops! folks seem to find them in this world but there is not even one mentioned in all the scripture!)

7.    Fundraiser, raffle, auction, bake sale, food sales, Church sponsored businesses like thrift shops. 

8.   a. The Church Board
      b. "membership" "voting member", or formalized "member" of a church assembly.

9.   CLERGY Robes, vestments, formal church attire that distinguishes from others in the body of Christ.

10.  Christians tithing

11.  A "Worship Leader"

12.  Church record keeping of who gave an amount

13.  elders submitting to a pastor as a form of church government

14.  the "church" instructed to:  buy property, have a "building fund", or "building program".

15.  a programmed church "service".   i.e.: prayer, 3 songs, offering, sermon, closing prayer.

16.  Positions of overseership. (superintendents, Districts, Stakes, Wards, etc.)   

17.  The "Sinners Prayer" as a rote or liturgical response to the gospel.

18.  A Pulpit

19.  Christians celebrating Christmas, Easter, HELLoween, or Sunday becoming the Sabbath. 

20.  a "Song Service"

21.  A Church Choir

22.  Sunday School (Sabbath school)

23.  "Spiritual Covering" by a pastor or hierarchy.

24.   Any "church" referred to as the "Storehouse".

25.  Prayer or homage to Mary, any "saint", Rosary, or statue.

26.  Cardinal, Pope, "Your Eminence", or "Father" used to address any Christian.

27.  Purgatory

28.  The Mass

29.   Lent

30    Prayers for the dead.

31.   The phrase "God uses doctors"

32.  "Repeat after me...."   as in "leading"  someone in prayer.

33.  Pastors given a "vision" for the church.

34.  Pledges, promissary oaths, swearing to perform an action such as a fundraiser or allegiance.

35.  Anything resembling patriotism to a kingdom of this world.

36.  Any "clergy" titles: "Doctor", "Prophet", "Bishop", "Apostle", "Elder", "Pastor" "Co-pastor", "chaplain"         "Associate  Pastor",  "Youth Pastor", "Reverend"     (see Those Wonderful Titles")  or the short article "Titles"

37.  "God helps those who help themselves".  -not in scripture..

38.   Any church or saint directly instructed to "Keep the Sabbath" (as observed in the Old Covenant).  see our article "How to REALLY Keep that Sabbath"

39.  Any church or saint in the New Testament commanded to observe the Old Testament feasts.

40.  Any church or saint in the New Testament being commanded to observe circumcision and/ or keep the Law of Moses.

41.  Palm Sunday

42.  Ash Wednesday

43.  Easter (the word easter pertains to Ishtar, a pagan Babylonian goddess).

44. "worship" service.   (find a mention of one in the New Testament)

46.  "Voting" in a pastor

47.   a LITURGY

48.  Anyone taking "sacraments".  False works give false assurance.

49. A parsonage (house) given to any pastor by a church.

50. The word "Trinity"
-one of the great sacred cows. A name invented by men never given in scripture.  If you were a Christian living in 100 AD you would never had heard the word because it had not been invented yet.  Anyone who simply reads the Bible for themselves without attending any Christian religion will not be leavened with the unscriptural word, "trinity". None of the writers of scripture ever used the term.

It is true, all the above are without a single verse in the New Testament scriptures and are red flag warnings of apostasy to one degree or another. That should alarm you and cause you to consider in Godly fear,  all the warnings in scripture regarding "be not deceived", false teachers, false prophets, and the Nicolaitanes who serve the Harlot church, "Mystery Babylon the Great".

Men are real good at rationalizing, justifying, and explaining what they do that is contrary to God's Word.
Do NOT accept any "puffed up" human reasoning or explanation for continuing in an unscriptural religious practice.   "that in us ye might learn not to go beyond the things which are written; that no one of you be puffed up for the one against the other." 

Belief is as the scripture says, not tradition, not your priest, not your pastor, not the guy on TBN, not me,  and not blind ignorance of God's Word. You are capable of hearing from God for yourself without me or anyone else trying to convert you to their way of thinking.

My job is to point you to the Bible to read it for yourself.  We can teach the scriptures but only God gives revelation and understanding.  The Lord is a much better instructor than me or anyone wearing an eccleastical title.

Apostasy from God's Word is exactly what the prophets confronted.
Ezekiel 34 is a clear prophecy about the shepherds and leaders of Apostate modern Christianity.  Jeremiah 23 is another.

And here is:
Isa. 3:1
And in that day seven women             (as the 7 churches in Revelation ch 2,3)
shall take hold of one man,               (calling on Jesus)
saying, We will eat our own bread,     ( we will follow our own faith & doctrine)
and wear our own apparel:                 (putting on false outward righteousness)
only let us be called by thy name,      (Christian in name but not disciples)
to take away our reproach.               (they want sins forgiven but do not obey the covenant)

a reader wrote: Comments:  I just read your "NOT in Scripture List" and I'm rather surprised... not at what is on the list, but that others have noticed.  I've been in and out of churches since I was a child and at the age of 28 I "heard" the call of Christ to "come follow me".  Just over a year later, I got up the nerve to read the bible for myself, since many of the people I respected in my "church" discussed what they were reading often.  I started in the new testament because it was immediately about Jesus and he was the reason for my being.  Well, I foud out the same things that were in your list and I was shocked, angry confused...  It was also immediately clear that the whole Idea of the modern church was nothing like the churches in ACTS.  Anyway, I've been labled a "radical" and ignored by others when I attempt to discuss these things and asked where we went wrong.  I have only one couple who "get it" too. thank you, -Reader in Florida
2007 Rory Moore   www.preparehisway.com
This article may be reproduced and distributed free of charge as long as it remains in its original form.

[titushome]

OOJ,

Thanks for the list.  I think most believers would defend many of the items on the list (though which items would change with each person) as being useful for the Church fulfilling her mission.  And as long as those things do, in fact, help the Church accomplish her mission, then I might agree there's nothing wrong with them.

But I see too much where these things become the mission, instead of helping the mission; they become ends in themselves, rather than just means to the Lord's ends.  A good example is church buildings: it is now widely assumed among believers that local church groups must own their own buildings, and they will go to great lengths to purchase and maintain their buildings.  Ownership of a building has become a goal to be achieved, rather than a means to help the Church accomplish the Lord's work.

Getting back to the topic at hand, is it heretical to teach that a church should own a building?  What about the other things on the list?

[dnr1128]

Usually heretical beliefs are those which fall outside the mainstream of Christianity at that given time.

But heresies, at least those defined by scripture, don't change with the changing times or values of Christian society. Do you mean what people may call heresy at any given time, as opposed to actual heresy?

In common usage, heresy is any doctrine that falls outside the mainstream beliefs.  Scripturally, I would consider heresy any doctrine "other than that which we have preached unto you", Galatians 1:8

[onli-one-jehovi]

OOJ,

Thanks for the list.  I think most believers would defend many of the items on the list (though which items would change with each person) as being useful for the Church fulfilling her mission.  And as long as those things do, in fact, help the Church accomplish her mission, then I might agree there's nothing wrong with them.

But I see too much where these things become the mission, instead of helping the mission; they become ends in themselves, rather than just means to the Lord's ends.  A good example is church buildings: it is now widely assumed among believers that local church groups must own their own buildings, and they will go to great lengths to purchase and maintain their buildings.  Ownership of a building has become a goal to be achieved, rather than a means to help the Church accomplish the Lord's work.

Getting back to the topic at hand, is it heretical to teach that a church should own a building?  What about the other things on the list?

Personally - I think it can be. Such structures may, and I stress MAY, have been tolerated during the course of our bondage. Much like those captured in Babylon were advised to buy houses and land.

We - as in the Church at large - are still severely trapped within the coils of Babylonish religion and its practices. 1700 yrs is a long time. We have reinstated the heirarchial priesthood as THE primary manner of relating with our Father; even though Jesus fulfilled and abolished such things within Himself. We call our "high priest" {that's what he is no matter what we may say} Father, Pastor, Bishop, Apostle, Elder, etc, etc - in direct disobedience to the commands of Jesus Himself. And because our "high priest" operates in a fleshly office of his/our own choosing, contradicting the Words of Christ; an edifice must be built/bought to showcase his ministry and feed the carnal appetites of his people.

"God deserves the best" is the rallying cry. So we go into debt{with the worldly banks} and begin to pour our hard-earned money into maintaining and expanding an idol of wood and stone. I've been in Dallas for 30yrs, and 29 of those has been spent upon paying off a building/property loan. It's never been paid off and never will be. Every few years a "greater need" surfaces to refinance and add to the pile.

Think for one moment the amount of interest lost to the Kingdom. The poor aren't really helped much,nor the widows and orphans. The needs of the congregation - when jobs are lost, medical help, etc - are virtually ignored. Gotta pay for the "House of God". Gotta pay "God's annointed".

Does that sound like anything Jesus told us to do? So, yes it can be heresy. I believe in most cases it is.

Question: How many saints of God can stand on their own, with no one but the Holy Ghost as companion/teacher/guide? How many saints can stand w/o being able to run to Pastor or the church building and its services?

Answer: Sadly, not many. But they/we are going to have to learn. And quickly.

Other things on the list: whoo, so many. Tithing definately is heresy. It's been scripturally proven here on this forum that NT saints are exempt. Much like OT non-farmers were exempt. And yes, that includes Carpenters and Fishermen. Any queries on that, go to the topic and search scripture for yourself.

Keeping the Sabbath as a "holy day". Jesus is the Sabbath. In Him we're always observing the "holy day".

Ministerial covering: nothing more than a means of controlling people.

Pastor, Father, Bishop: Usurping Christ's authority over His own Body. Tell the local "man of God" that "the LORD is my Shepherd" and see what happens. Jesus is the only head. Everyone one else is an equal part. Different responsibilities - not different authorities.

Merchandizing: That one really gets my goat! Freely you have received; freely give. That includes the current trend of recording preaching. Quit selling a 40cent cd/dvd for 5+ dollars. And stop with the bake sales, car washes, etc. That's just begging! Most such things are for the flesh anyway.

I better stop.

The Church is beginning to rouse from her slumber. Many of our heresies will be sloughed off as we concentrate upon intimacy with the King. As we light our lamps, the shadows of darkness will recede and we will put away most of our fleshly things. Alas, some things will have to be burned off.

We are in the day of the coming of the Lord. He tells us in Ezek 14 that though Daniel, Noah, and Job stood before Him; their righteousness would not save sons or daughters. We are at the time of individuality and no Pastor, Prophet, Priest, mother, father or anyone else is responsible for us. We must examine ourselves for any heresies we hold to and cast them aside. It's not easy. And it is very painful. But we must.

[onli-one-jehovi]

I'm not quite sure how everything was bold. Oh well.

To clarify a bit.... though the NT never commands us to build a "temple/house of worship"; we also understand the sometime need to have one. In a community, it is far easier to meet centrally. Is this wrong? Again, not necessarily. We just have to be careful that the central meeting place does not take over "house to house" meetings. By that, I mean the frequent getting together of the Church Body. Personal experience indicates a smaller group both ministers to and is ministered by one another with better results. Funny how the large churches "discovered" cell ministry concept. That's what we're supposed to be doing all along.

We just should separate ourselves from the necessity of "going to church" in order to have a scriptural relationship with Jesus. I received an email voicing a similar outlook. I'll post it below.

[onli-one-jehovi]

 
Dear Friends,


For those of you who are "outside the camp"...
   
How many times do you catch yourself missing the things that "church" offers?

Especially this time of year, with the holidays approaching, it can be a lonely time for some who used to go to church.
   
Do you miss the singing, praise and worship, Women's ministry, Men's ministry, potluck dinners, preaching, tithing/giving, children's ministries, even listening to people giving "prophetic words" (just to name a few).

Ask yourself a question...

Are the "things" that I miss really ministering to the LORD or to ME?
     
Really look deep into yourself and ask this question.

"Church" for the most part gives you the mindset of Martha. Busy little Martha, trying to minister to others, much serving, and even fulfilling her own need to be needed; maybe even fulfilling a desire to be in charge (because she thought Mary should be doing more to help her).
     
How many of you can remember working your butt off in churches thinking, "Why isn't everyone else working as hard as me?"
     
But we see Mary is sitting at the feet of Jesus, ministering to Him.
     
A lot of people write in and ask us what it means or looks like to minister to the Lord. I always picture Mary sitting quietly at Jesus' feet.  She has no other person on her mind or any concerns other than sitting at His feet and listening, talking, sharing, and loving the Lord Jesus while He is right there in front of her.
     
Did she do this 24/7? No, of course not. Jesus went on with what His Father had Him to do, and Mary went on to do her daily things that needed to be done. But remember that she did take time out to sit at His feet and Jesus said this is what is needed.

So when you start to miss the things you once enjoyed so much in "church", remember where the Lord has brought you. Do not be like the children of Israel who always complained and wanted to go back to Egypt, thinking you had it better in "church".
     
There is a reason and a purpose for bringing you out. Let the Lord guide you in this new walk.  Let Him teach you His ways - which are far better then your ways or the church's ways.  And remember that the main lesson is: He will increase and I will decrease. This process is not an easy one but you have to go through it!


In Him,

Karla Brogden

http://www.theschoolofchrist.org

[titushome]

Do you miss the singing, praise and worship, Women's ministry, Men's ministry, potluck dinners, preaching, tithing/giving, children's ministries, even listening to people giving "prophetic words" (just to name a few).

Ask yourself a question...

Are the "things" that I miss really ministering to the LORD or to ME?
     
Really look deep into yourself and ask this question.

"Church" for the most part gives you the mindset of Martha. Busy little Martha, trying to minister to others, much serving, and even fulfilling her own need to be needed; maybe even fulfilling a desire to be in charge (because she thought Mary should be doing more to help her).

As Karla Brogden words it, it sounds like an either/or proposition.  But most of the things on her list are specifically mentioned in the Bible, and when done correctly we minister to the Lord, and he ministers to us.  It should be both - not either/or.

It's true that with "church" as we know it in our culture, it's easy to do busy work and miss the Lord completely.  But that doesn't mean it must be so, that the only way to avoid this trap is to stop participating in church activities.

[onli-one-jehovi]

Titushome:As Karla Brogden words it, it sounds like an either/or proposition.  But most of the things on her list are specifically mentioned in the Bible, and when done correctly we minister to the Lord, and he ministers to us.  It should be both - not either/or.

It's true that with "church" as we know it in our culture, it's easy to do busy work and miss the Lord completely.  But that doesn't mean it must be so, that the only way to avoid this trap is to stop participating in church activities.


Agreed. Yet looking at the Church in general, most christians equate the works of worship/praise/church activities as their relationship with the Lord. It's a "done my part" sort of deal.

How often I've heard established saints say: "Can't wait to get to church to get my praise on" - as if "getting my praise on" couldn't happen anywhere else.  Take away the building, music, the preacher, the congregation, activities, and anything else we associate with "church" - and the average saint finds themselves pretty much incapable of truly ministering or being ministered by God.

That is the gist of what I found her to say. And that is the difference between being in the wilderness and being in the camp.  The Holy Ghost leads us out of the camp into the wilderness to be taught by Him. Thus the heresies of the Nicolatian overlording priesthood tries to keep us in bondage to spiritual Babylon. Most of the saints need to get away from "church" and step out with Jesus to be cleansed of the leaven. Then can we put in proper alighnment our ministering to the Lord. 

[Raven180]

As I recall from one of my Bible dictionaries, the word heresy in Greek literally means or refers to "school of thought". If this is so, and I think it is, that speaks volumes as to what a heresy really is.

"Schools"... indicates more than one opinion, which indicates division. We are all urged to say the same thing. To say ought else than what the apostles and prophets and Jesus Christ the chief cornerstone said is to have a school of thought which differs from the Word of God.

As much as we hate to admit it, there isn't supposed to be multiple interpretations/understandings of Scripture. The Holy Spirit of Truth should lead us all into the same revelation of TRUTH. The fact that we do not agree is not the fault of the God of Truth, but rather the result of the frailty and insidious nature of our flesh which constantly falls prey to the deceivableness of sin.

So, I conclude that heresy is any conclusion to which one comes with which the Spirit of Truth does not agree; therefore the Spirit of Truth did not lead that person to such because the Spirit of Truth will never break the Word and never lead God's people into a variety of interpretations of Its own Word.

[Raven180]

[

As I recall from one of my Bible dictionaries, the word heresy in Greek literally means or refers to "school of thought". If this is so, and I think it is, that speaks volumes as to what a heresy really is.

"Schools"... indicates more than one opinion, which indicates division. We are all urged to say the same thing. To say ought else than what the apostles and prophets and Jesus Christ the chief cornerstone said is to have a school of thought which differs from the Word of God.

As much as we hate to admit it, there isn't supposed to be multiple interpretations/understandings of Scripture. The Holy Spirit of Truth should lead us all into the same revelation of TRUTH. The fact that we do not agree is not the fault of the God of Truth, but rather the result of the frailty and insidious nature of our flesh which constantly falls prey to the deceivableness of sin.

So, I conclude that heresy is any conclusion to which one comes with which the Spirit of Truth does not agree; therefore the Spirit of Truth did not lead that person to such because the Spirit of Truth will never break the Word and never lead God's people into a variety of interpretations of Its own Word.

Also, "schools" indicates teaching, showing that someone is teaching conclusions contrary to the Spirit of Truth. James 3:1 comes to mind. Dangerous stuff.

[(R.I.P.) YooperYankDude]

As I recall from one of my Bible dictionaries, the word heresy in Greek literally means or refers to "school of thought". If this is so, and I think it is, that speaks volumes as to what a heresy really is.

"Schools"... indicates more than one opinion, which indicates division. We are all urged to say the same thing. To say ought else than what the apostles and prophets and Jesus Christ the chief cornerstone said is to have a school of thought which differs from the Word of God.

As much as we hate to admit it, there isn't supposed to be multiple interpretations/understandings of Scripture. The Holy Spirit of Truth should lead us all into the same revelation of TRUTH. The fact that we do not agree is not the fault of the God of Truth, but rather the result of the frailty and insidious nature of our flesh which constantly falls prey to the deceivableness of sin.

So, I conclude that heresy is any conclusion to which one comes with which the Spirit of Truth does not agree; therefore the Spirit of Truth did not lead that person to such because the Spirit of Truth will never break the Word and never lead God's people into a variety of interpretations of Its own Word.

I have stayed out of this discussion up to this point in time... I kept telling myself I would simply read it and not post... lol.

I agree with what you said!

I guess one thing that puzzles me... is how Preachers who supposedly have the same exact Holy Ghost living in them, (since we know that there are not different Holy Ghosts for different people, there is only one Spirit of God!)... can be so diametrically opposed on things! Someone is wrong and someone is right... but you would think that them having the same Holy Ghost would help them... instead we have all these groups (speaking in reference to Apostolic Pentecostals) and cliques that all claim they are correct, and if you don't sit at their table in their group... your lost or backslid, or heretics.

I have always wondered and have asked a few if there will be segregation in heaven between our groups like there is here on earth... will the former UPCI be able to fellowship the independents... or the WPF, or the ALJC... or is there a wall between them in heaven like there is here.  I may not agree with my brother from any of those organizations... but I will be very careful before I go and call my brother, who is a joint heir with me of Jesus Christ... a heretic!

What are the neccessities to being saved. What are the basics? Beyond that it is a relationship issue. I didn't die for them, they are not responsible to me and nor will they answer to me... but each man will be judged by God... and not by what their Brother or Sister did. By what they themselves did!

Don't know...  just my thoughts... gonna keep pondering.

Sorry... don't want to derail this discussion...  God Bless...

[onli-one-jehovi]

I am coming to understand a little more clearly *possible* reasons for such discrepancies.

I believe first and foremost that it is the result of having this treasure in earthen vessels. Scripturally, there are two types of bread offered before the LORD: barley and wheat. Barley bread is not allowed to have any leaven at all, while wheat bread is allowed a mixture of leaven.

I think this is representative to our progressive growth in Christ. The goal is to be conformed to the image of Christ - pure, unleavened barley - from humble beginnings as wheat. Thus, so many heresies infecting our minds has to be changed by the washing of the Word. As we learn to listen to the voice of the Great Shepherd, the leaven is removed and the wheat becomes barley.

It is when our prideful self chooses to ignore the Word that heresies bloom and the wheat becomes a tare, rather than barley. Can't remember the exact scripture, but isn't it something like "divisions come from the lust of your members" or something like that? Our strong desire to be "right" or "in charge" overwhelms and makes the Word of none effect.

That's what I think at this time.

Reminded of a comical response:  I could agree with you but then we'd both be wrong!

[onli-one-jehovi]

I read an ebook today that may shed a little light on why heresies occur. It is primarily referring to women being under submission to Man and Christ, but there is some pretty good points made regarding Man's submission also. It deals with headship and coverings and how we must align ourselves with true biblical government. The Babylonian method will never produce what GOD intends.

It's called: Sarah's Children and found at http://www.heart4god.ws/id242.htm.

Here is an excerpt. I highly recommend to read.

In I Peter 3 we are given Sarah as an example of a godly and submissive wife, and immediately afterward the great obstacle to following in her example is listed. The obstacle is fear. Many women fear that if they submit to their husbands, and they do not correct them when they are wrong, if they do not constantly make known their own desires and needs before their husbands, they will somehow be neglected, abused, or suffer in some way. It takes faith in God to overcome these fears and to place one's trust in Yahweh. It takes faith to remain silent and to trust that Yahweh will correct a husband who is disobedient to the word. Sadly, too many women exercise fear rather than faith, and the results are seen in the church and in our society.

The same is certainly true of men who are afraid to trust Christ and to follow Him wherever He leads. Many refuse to let go of the reins of their lives. They fear that Christ might lead them down paths that are terrifying to them. They are afraid that somehow their own needs and desires will be overlooked or neglected. They respond out of fear and uncover their heads.

We all need grace to walk in these things, tremendous grace. This life is fraught with perils, and we need the comfort and assurance of a Savior who loves us enough to lay down His life for us.

I'm now going to be lookng into a deeper understanding of this, so that many *heresies* in my own life can be removed.