Apostolic Truth Questions

[onli-one-jehovi]

i want to believe theres no difference. for one that is why it is called apostolic. we follow the apostles teachings and Jesus taught the apostles.

does your question go any deeper than that? care to elaborate? example?


                                           -yo

It can always go deeper. But, all my life I've heard Apostolics {and did it myself} speak of having "the truth". I believe that Israel in Egypt is a type of coming out of sin or the world; while Israel in Babylon is a type of coming out of religion or man inspired doctrine. I also believe that the last couple of years - this year especially- has shown the Lord calling more and more to come out of spiritual Babylon, and re-discover the unleavened bread of the Word.

Every denomination has its "truth",lived and passed down to congregations. Every family has done the same: added leaven to the Word. Since God is calling His people to back to Himself, -in preparation for His return-, it seems very important to know:

Is Apostolic truth different than Biblical truth?

[onli-one-jehovi]

Looks like a good start, Brother Dad. This being the 4th and all, I'm not able to give more than a quick note. More will come later, probably this week end. Then I promise to participate a lot fuller.


Apostolic Truth is Bible truth anything else is false doctrine.

Do not all other parts of the Body say the same thing? What's the difference?


Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.

We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?


The Bible definition of Apostolic Truth Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone, and a cornerstone is a finished product for exact emulation - shouldn't Jesus' teachings/words/example be our mirror?

You've posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can't post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible.


Beleive it or be lost.

You used this phrase a lot. I take it to be applying to Apostolic truth. Our history is not one of great confidence in one another.

Therefore, is this statement personal, biblical, or universal among followers of Apostolic truth?



That's all the time I have right now. Thank you for participating. I look forward to continuing later.

[Brother Dad]

Apostolic Truth is Bible truth anything else is false doctrine.
Do not all other parts of the Body say the same thing? What's the difference? 

There are no other parts of the body.  Anything else is lost.


Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.  Hey that is why we do home Bible studies in peoples homes.  And yes the according to Paul the ministry was to live by the Gospel.

We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?  If you are not One God Apostolic then no you are not Truth


The Bible definition of Apostolic Truth Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone, and a cornerstone is a finished product for exact emulation - shouldn't Jesus' teachings/words/example be our mirror?

You've posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can't post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible. I could post many of Jesus Words but the false teachers that are lost still will not beleive them for they are Bblinded by the God of this wordl.


Beleive it or be lost.

You used this phrase a lot. I take it to be applying to Apostolic truth. Our history is not one of great confidence in one another.

Therefore, is this statement personal, biblical, or universal among followers of Apostolic truth? This statment is based upon Bible and History and the leading of my Lord Jesus Christ.



That's all the time I have right now. Thank you for participating. I look forward to continuing later.

Post all you want I will stop posting along these lines Becasue if you can't see it then you are blinded my the God of this world.  If you do see it then we will meet in heaven.  Anyone beleiving the trinity is part of the mother harlot church and not God's Church. 

True Apostolics beleive the entire Bible and stand on it.  And we do not try to teach the false teaching that God is persons and not a Spirit.

[yosemite]

i couldnt say it much better myself but as for scripture i cant say it any better. but i do have some more scripture that would fit to that quite nicely.  bro dad is on target for me!!

if they didnt take offerings and tieths, what was judas doing with the groups money bag. what was the money bag for? where did the money come from?
what was the money used for? the money bag must have been alright to start with because Jesus allowed it unlike the money changers in the temple.

Apostolic Truth is Bible truth anything else is false doctrine.
Do not all other parts of the Body say the same thing? What’s the difference? 

There are no other parts of the body.  Anything else is lost.


Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.  Hey that is why we do home Bible studies in peoples homes.  And yes the according to Paul the ministry was to live by the Gospel.

We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?  If you are not One God Apostolic then no you are not Truth


The Bible definition of Apostolic Truth Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone, and a cornerstone is a finished product for exact emulation - shouldn’t Jesus’ teachings/words/example be our mirror?

You’ve posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can’t post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible. I could post many of Jesus Words but the false teachers that are lost still will not beleive them for they are Bblinded by the God of this wordl.


Beleive it or be lost.

You used this phrase a lot. I take it to be applying to Apostolic truth. Our history is not one of great confidence in one another.

Therefore, is this statement personal, biblical, or universal among followers of Apostolic truth? This statment is based upon Bible and History and the leading of my Lord Jesus Christ.



That’s all the time I have right now. Thank you for participating. I look forward to continuing later.

Post all you want I will stop posting along these lines Becasue if you can't see it then you are blinded my the God of this world.  If you do see it then we will meet in heaven.  Anyone beleiving the trinity is part of the mother harlot church and not God's Church. 

True Apostolics beleive the entire Bible and stand on it.  And we do not try to teach the false teaching that God is persons and not a Spirit.

the word God in this case is a lower case god not a respected God of higher case.
instead of my it is by in the MY that is bolded. thanks bro dad. LOL

[yosemite]

Looks like a good start, Brother Dad. This being the 4th and all, I’m not able to give more than a quick note. More will come later, probably this week end. Then I promise to participate a lot fuller.


Apostolic Truth is Bible truth anything else is false doctrine.

Do not all other parts of the Body say the same thing? What’s the difference?
the body will not grow a third arm, leg, ear, eye. all other portions of the body that is not of the body is false.do you beleive that a man with a prosthetic leg
when he dies(if saved) his prosthetic leg will go to heaven? why not? did the false leg not do a good work? did it not look just like a true leg? is it because it didnt have the Holyspirit and was more worldly and materialistic? well thats just unfair isnt it!! or is it?

Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.
well now, who were they writing the epistles to? the apostles were bishops to all the churches who followed their teachings of Christ. paul worked as a tent maker for his survival but the churches had offerings as do the missionaries of this day and time live and spread the word on.if the churches didnt give ties or offering what was all that with anninias when he got into trouble? where did all that money go? did they spread the word with it? did the apostles use a portion of it to travel with the word?did the bible say that the workman is worthy of his wage? do you beleive that a preacher is not worthy of his wage?i dont limit myself to social services either. i go in the word all the time, learning, praying and worshiping.(in my own way of course)
We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?
i dont see anything different other than modern tech.

The Bible definition of Apostolic Truth Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone, and a cornerstone is a finished product for exact emulation - shouldn’t Jesus’ teachings/words/example be our mirror?

You’ve posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can’t post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible.
are you suggesting that the apostles were antichrist? were the apostles not teaching the very word of Christ? as far as i can see and read what they teach  fits like a glove to what Jesus taught. we lean on no man but the scripture is used as a good proof.
Beleive it or be lost.          dido

You used this phrase a lot. I take it to be applying to Apostolic truth. Our history is not one of great confidence in one another.
well its best to not have confidence in those who prove themselves wrong.you know, the double minded man and all.
Therefore, is this statement personal, biblical, or universal among followers of Apostolic truth?
if they follow the bible it is universal!!


That’s all the time I have right now. Thank you for participating. I look forward to continuing later.
okiedokie!!   -yo             

[yosemite]

Hello Brother Yo, Hope all is well.  Remember what I told you, you can not show a blind man anything.  Those who chose to stand by and try to teach false doctrine of a trinity are lost and we know what the Bible says.  If this Gospel be hid it is hid to those who are lost.  Who the god of this world has blinded.  So I advise you to leave those you know will not receive the truth along.  What fellowship has light with darkness.  Truth divides, and  separates.  Some are nothing more than trouble makers and I don't care if they like me or not. Jesus said we would be hated for His name sake.  Not hated because of a trinity that was dream up by some half serving ungodly men after people started drifting away from truth.  The Bible say ever learning but never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.  It is useless to try and discuss truth with those who refuse it.  Hang tight and just keep praying.  God will show the world who He really is when ever knee shall bow.  You know Benny Hinn says there is nine in the godhead.  He says they are distinct persons.  Each person has a body, soul, and spirit.  Three times three is nine.  He said this on TBN. Trash Broadcasting Network.  But I gues if we start with one and get three then why not nine or more.  If you going to be wrong might as well go way out there.  I encourage you to stop responding to these guys that want to stir the pot.  I writing this to you to let you know I am here for you man.

hey bro didnt see the post till now, and i agree to the fact there are several veiw points of the blind,(enlightened ones, trinity and just beleive to name a few).
a better question to be pondered is who is wrong? is anybody wrong? i guess the normall mans answer is that all are going to heaven. not my opinion, as to what the word says. a rightious man scarcely makes it!! the path to destruction is broad and many be that travel it. who will travel the straight and narrow for few be that find it. i'll do my best to stay on the old path , the straight and narrow path. the tale of the broad path lets me know that not many are gonna make it and will be deceived. that is why i am so definsive on my faith and it is not something to be taken so lightly. as i said before, ya gotta stand for something or you'll fall for anything. just as my grandmother didnt want dice in the house, i dont want to get started in the new concept and an enlightened view. these are mans lilly livered, wobbled knee, spineless  doctrines.

[apsurf]

That is kinda what they used to say about the pentecostal experience....

[Brother Dad]

I am so glad I know for sure what is right.  My prayers go up for those who were once in the Apostolic Pentecostal Truth and has denied it and now are lost.  I just hope they have not gone too far.

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
People who have denied the truth are lost.  Does not matter who they are. 

[Brother Dad]

You’ve posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can’t post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible.


Wow I was sure the Scripture I used from Luke 24 was the Lord Jesus Christ speaking.

[OGIA]

Re: the Father vs. the Son terminology and the trinitarian accusations: I personally don't see any trinitarian reference from OOJ, and I have no problem using the terms these days.  I know the difference between the two and what each references.  Fact is, there are clearly two roles presented in the NT until all things are placed under His feet (1 Cor 15).  There is also a forever-more, physical manifestation of the One God, who, by the way, is called the Father only once in the OT, but many, many times in the NT.

We can't ignore the terminology, but I do pray that we always remember that these do not refer to the number of persons that God "is".  It is all about relationship of Spirit to Spirit manifested.  That One Spirit will always be the eternal One called "Father" (Spirit) and, since approx. 4BC known to the world as Jesus Christ, the Son of God (same Spirit manifested as human). 

Do I have it all figured out?  Nope.  I still get a bit confused by some of the terminology, but I have cemented in my belief that there is One God and His name IS Jesus Christ.  That is His identity, just as mine is John.

Since God is calling His people to back to Himself, -in preparation for His return-, it seems very important to know:

Is Apostolic truth different than Biblical truth?

I say "no".  Does Apostolic truth encompass the whole of the Biblical truth?  Again, I say "no".  But, it does encompass the truths we, as the Gentile bride, are governed by.  There were no "Apostolic truths" before this new covenant era.  That, IMO, is why it is used.  Why would we use anything else to discuss the covenant we are under?  Is Tabernacle truth different than Biblical truth?  Is Mosaic truth, Davidic truth, Adamic truth, etc, etc?  There's nothing wrong with a thread asking for answers to "Apostolic truth questions", because it simply points us to the time that we live under and the commandments we are required to obey to be a part of His Kingdom.

The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.  We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?

Where did the Apostles gather?  What day(s) of the week?  Who was James of Jerusalem?  Who were the "elders" Paul appointed to the Gentile congregations?  How did they make a living?  Did they work until they dropped dead and another elder replaced them?  Where did Paul stay when he journeyed?  What about the other evangelists?

It seems that there is much left out of the specifics of the Church that maybe God left to man to figure out how to accomplish according to the time His people would live in.  Are there any specific commandments regarding the above?  If not, are they really "apostolic truths" or just apostolic lifestyles/preferences? 

shouldn’t Jesus’ teachings/words/example be our mirror?

Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can’t post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible.

Do those who are born again and living a life pleasing to the Lord need to quote the "words in red" when supporting a belief with another who claims to be a brother?  Isn't the understanding that the Lord is the very One who inspired the whole Book and that just because we find some of His words "in red" they are no more important in this regard than those in black in Leviticus or Philemon? 

Apostolic truths (defined above), IMO, don't have to have words in red to support them when discussing topics with brethren of like precious faith.  I know what Brother Dad posted would have been just as valid as the words of God in flesh (aka the words in red) even if he hadn't included the Luke passage.  He does not have to give equal or even more weight to the words of Jesus Christ to establish a belief for me.  I know his belief about the God who spoke "Let there be light" and Who also cried in a manger.  That is enough for me for him to post something from Genesis to Revelation and not have to balance it out with the words of Jesus to substantiate his thought.

[yosemite]

Re: the Father vs. the Son terminology and the trinitarian accusations: I personally don't see any trinitarian reference from OOJ, and I have no problem using the terms these days.   I know the difference between the two and what each references.  Fact is, there are clearly two roles presented in the NT until all things are placed under His feet (1 Cor 15).  There is also a forever-more, physical manifestation of the One God, who, by the way, is called the Father only once in the OT, but many, many times in the NT.

We can't ignore the terminology, but I do pray that we always remember that these do not refer to the number of persons that God "is".  It is all about relationship of Spirit to Spirit manifested.  That One Spirit will always be the eternal One called "Father" (Spirit) and, since approx. 4BC known to the world as Jesus Christ, the Son of God (same Spirit manifested as human). 

Do I have it all figured out?  Nope.  I still get a bit confused by some of the terminology, but I have cemented in my belief that there is One God and His name IS Jesus Christ.  That is His identity, just as mine is John.

i dont have a problem with using the termenology either. i just feel that when it is all you use it is considered to be pushing a trinity issue and subtlely trying to change someones veiw from oneness to trinity. thats why i guess i get aggressive in this issue, i phsyco anallize too deep!!??  LOL sence i feel that oneness has been revealed to me i no longer have to use these terms and i take liberty in not doing so.
when it used to be father son and holyghost i can now say God or Jesus, wichever my brain comes up with first. to me it is one in the same!!

dido on not having it all figured out!! just the facts, mamm!! (dragnet)LOL  -yo

[Brother Dad]

Re: the Father vs. the Son terminology and the trinitarian accusations: I personally don't see any trinitarian reference from OOJ, and I have no problem using the terms these days.  I know the difference between the two and what each references.  Fact is, there are clearly two roles presented in the NT until all things are placed under His feet (1 Cor 15).  There is also a forever-more, physical manifestation of the One God, who, by the way, is called the Father only once in the OT, but many, many times in the NT.

We can't ignore the terminology, but I do pray that we always remember that these do not refer to the number of persons that God "is".  It is all about relationship of Spirit to Spirit manifested.  That One Spirit will always be the eternal One called "Father" (Spirit) and, since approx. 4BC known to the world as Jesus Christ, the Son of God (same Spirit manifested as human). 

Terminology is no problem for a true Apostolic Believer.  For we know He is Fahter in creation, Son In redemption, Holy Ghost in the Church.  He is my Heavenly Father, Bright and morning Star, Lilly of my valley, ect.

[yosemite]

Terminology is no problem for a true Apostolic Believer.  For we know He is Fahter in creation, Son In redemption, Holy Ghost in the Church.  He is my Heavenly Father, Bright and morning Star, Lilly of my valley, ect.
i dont have a problem with using the termenology either. i just feel that when it is all you use it is considered to be pushing a trinity issue and subtlely trying to change someones veiw from oneness to trinity. or maybe i just have a thorn in my side, or a bur under my saddle!! LOL  -yo

[OGIA]

Dittos yo and Bro. Dad. 

And I understand what both of you are saying.  While I don't have a problem with the terms, I do still have a problem when people use the term "Father" and oppose it to the name "Jesus".  No problem with using "Father" in opposition to "Son", because there is a difference there.  But, I don't oppose the terms Father and Jesus because they are one and the same person.  One term identifies role, one confirms identity.

[yosemite]

  since i know bro. dad and trust his judgement i kinda stay close to what he says also. beginning to like what you say also ogia. i feel that when i study and come out on the same page as you two i must not be far off. although i know my thoughts might need a fine tuning now and again. thanks!!   -yo

[Brother Dad]

I agree with your post OGIA Thank you for your input.

[titushome]

i dont have a problem with using the termenology either. i just feel that when it is all you use it is considered to be pushing a trinity issue and subtlely trying to change someones veiw from oneness to trinity....  LOL sence i feel that oneness has been revealed to me i no longer have to use these terms and i take liberty in not doing so.

I don't understand why you would say "I no longer have to use these terms."  These are the terms used by Jesus Himself, as well as by Jesus' apostles - Paul, Peter, James, John, Matthew, et al - in their writings!  Why the aversion to using the very terminology employed by Jesus and His apostles?  Should we not rather seek to properly understand what they are saying, and correct those whose understanding is incorrect?

I repeat, NO ONE here is setting forth trinitarian doctrine as truth.  Those of us here who use Father/Son terminology in reference to God do so with the same meaning, as best as we are able to understand, used by Jesus and His apostles.  None of us by doing so are trying to change anyone's view from oneness to trinity.

[yosemite]

 

[Brother Dad]

i dont have a problem with using the termenology either. i just feel that when it is all you use it is considered to be pushing a trinity issue and subtlely trying to change someones veiw from oneness to trinity....  LOL sence i feel that oneness has been revealed to me i no longer have to use these terms and i take liberty in not doing so.

I don't understand why you would say "I no longer have to use these terms."  These are the terms used by Jesus Himself, as well as by Jesus' apostles - Paul, Peter, James, John, Matthew, et al - in their writings!  Why the aversion to using the very terminology employed by Jesus and His apostles?  Should we not rather seek to properly understand what they are saying, and correct those whose understanding is incorrect?

I repeat, NO ONE here is setting forth trinitarian doctrine as truth.  Those of us here who use Father/Son terminology in reference to God do so with the same meaning, as best as we are able to understand, used by Jesus and His apostles.  None of us by doing so are trying to change anyone's view from oneness to trinity.

I agree I feel there is no way around using such terms.  I learned along time ago to that by avoiding these terms I often fueled the trinitarins fire.  It is better to understand them.  I will add in some cases when talking to trinitarains you are just wasteing your breath.  Learn to judge the spirit.  I come across many that are just wanting to cause a fuss.  Be strong in the Bible Truth about the only true and livng God.  Let us not give place to the devil by arguing with folks that refuse to see truth.  However always be ready to teach a good Bible study.

[yosemite]

bro dad:     I agree I feel there is no way around using such terms.  I learned along time ago to that by avoiding these terms I often fueled the trinitarins fire.  It is better to understand them.  I will add in some cases when talking to trinitarains you are just wasteing your breath.  Learn to judge the spirit.  I come across many that are just wanting to cause a fuss.  Be strong in the Bible Truth about the only true and livng God.  Let us not give place to the devil by arguing with folks that refuse to see truth.  However always be ready to teach a good Bible study.
******************************************************************************************************************************

so your saying to be instant in and out of season. decerning the time you should or shouldnt put your foot in your mouth. LOL i generally keep putting my foot in my mouth.  sorry!!     LOL

[onli-one-jehovi]

Sorting out from the holiday weekend. Getting back in the groove. Will catch up later in the evening/night. 

[onli-one-jehovi]

Apostolic Truth is Bible truth anything else is false doctrine.
Do not all other parts of the Body say the same thing? What's the difference? 

There are no other parts of the body.  Anything else is lost.


Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.  Hey that is why we do home Bible studies in peoples homes.  And yes the according to Paul the ministry was to live by the Gospel.

We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?  If you are not One God Apostolic then no you are not Truth


The Bible definition of Apostolic Truth Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone, and a cornerstone is a finished product for exact emulation - shouldn't Jesus' teachings/words/example be our mirror?

You've posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can't post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible. I could post many of Jesus Words but the false teachers that are lost still will not beleive them for they are Bblinded by the God of this wordl.


Beleive it or be lost.

You used this phrase a lot. I take it to be applying to Apostolic truth. Our history is not one of great confidence in one another.

Therefore, is this statement personal, biblical, or universal among followers of Apostolic truth? This statment is based upon Bible and History and the leading of my Lord Jesus Christ.



That's all the time I have right now. Thank you for participating. I look forward to continuing later.

Post all you want I will stop posting along these lines Becasue if you can't see it then you are blinded my the God of this world.  If you do see it then we will meet in heaven.  Anyone beleiving the trinity is part of the mother harlot church and not God's Church. 

True Apostolics beleive the entire Bible and stand on it.  And we do not try to teach the false teaching that God is persons and not a Spirit.

I won't waste your time, or mine Bro Dad. As stated earlier: we have a history of no confidence in one another. However, for the sake of discussion - and those who may read this - I will reply. Well, to a degree anyway.

Overall, I take it you believe anyone who does not accept Apostolic truth {doctrine} - with all its peculiarities - is lost w/o the truth. I think you believe Apostolic truth = biblical truth, as long as biblical truth does not disagree with Apostolic truth. {I think that's right}.

I recall Jesus saying: I am the way, the truth, and the life. He that believes in me shall have everlasting life. I don't recall Him saying Apostolic truth was the way, the truth, and the life. Nor do I recall Him saying belief on Apostolic truth granted everlasting life. I do remember him praying for those who would believe on Him, based upon His disciples' witness. The key being ON HIM though. That's what I meant by leaning on the Students more than the Master. Tendency to misunderstand what was said. 


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.
Hey that is why we do home Bible studies in peoples homes. And yes the according to Paul the ministry was to live by the Gospel.

We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?  If you are not One God Apostolic then no you are not Truth

You didn't answer the question. IF Apostolic truth is the same as Biblical Truth, why do we all continue to demand/accept tithes, support financially draining church buildings/programs, and take up offerings in payment of preaching? The Apostles did not do that, as there is -zero- NT scripture and -zero- historical evidence until about the 4th century. Biblical truth proves tithing was an ordinance of the Law of Moses, annulled at Calvary. There is nothing inherently wrong with buildings or paying someone. There is though when it is presented as "Thus saith the Lord, pay or be cursed."

Biblical truth records Jesus telling His disciples to take no money with them, for freely you have received, freely give. Biblical truth records Jesus not demanding money from anyone, nor setting up a "new priesthood" modeled after the old. Each believer is a priest and each believer is equal. Where do we get the idea that some are more equal than others and demanding of our support? Is it biblical or Apostolic?

So, if the Apostles didn't preach or do it, and the Bible confirms that, - when we do it, are we in truth?


Note that the Baptists, Assembly of God, Assembly of the Lord Jesus Christ, Methodists, etc, also teach the same thing on this subject. All teach the necessity of tithes and offerings to avoid the curse. Every one of them. Even though it is not Biblical Truth.

Biblical truth teaches giving as the Spirit leads. Giving to those who are in need, especially to the brethren.

Again, whose truth do we believe?

[onli-one-jehovi]

It is repeatedly inferred that I believe in the trinity. No I do not. Once again, I remind all the fine brothers and sisters of Godplace that I too see and understand DT 6:4; and have experienced Acts 2:38. That was in 1975. I've never changed that. Never disbelieved it. So back off the accusations when you run out of things to say. It doesn't anger me in the least. It does make you look bad.

[onli-one-jehovi]

i couldnt say it much better myself but as for scripture i cant say it any better. but i do have some more scripture that would fit to that quite nicely.  bro dad is on target for me!!

if they didnt take offerings and tieths, what was judas doing with the groups money bag. what was the money bag for? where did the money come from?
what was the money used for? the money bag must have been alright to start with because Jesus allowed it unlike the money changers in the temple.

Nothing wrong with the money bag. The money came from the free-will giving of people, not from a mandated requirement. In the OT, no one but farmers & ranchers paid tithes. The regular people did not. Tithes were to feed the Levitical priesthood who had no other way to feed themselves. This was how God provided for the Levites who alone ministered unto the Lord God. Jesus was showing the disciples that God was more than capable of meeting their needs, w/o dependence upon anyone else. He was teaching them to take no thought but depend upon God who knows your needs. That's why the Spirit of God moved upon some to share their God-blessed abundance. Just like the church did at its birth. We are supposed to do the same; when your brother is in need, meet that need from your abundance. We struggle to do so because our money first goes to the re-established priesthood, leaving little if any available for anyone else. How many in our congregations pay their way into poverty in order to support a pastor and building? How many have tithed their entire Christian lives and still have virtually nothing, while the "minister" lives high on the hog? 

Nothing personal toward any "minister". Just reference to the system as a whole.

[onli-one-jehovi]

Apostolic Truth is Bible truth anything else is false doctrine.

Do not all other parts of the Body say the same thing? What's the difference?

the body will not grow a third arm, leg, ear, eye. all other portions of the body that is not of the body is false.do you beleive that a man with a prosthetic leg
when he dies(if saved) his prosthetic leg will go to heaven? why not? did the false leg not do a good work? did it not look just like a true leg? is it because it didnt have the Holyspirit and was more worldly and materialistic? well thats just unfair isnt it!! or is it?


I don't understand this. I think you mean anything not Apostolic is false, like a prosthetic limb. My intended question is:

Do not other denominations say anything they don't believe is false doctrine too? Why is Apostolic truth any different than Baptist or Assembly of God truth? It seems Biblical truth is circumvented by all.


Acts 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.


The Apostles did not have a church building, nor limit services to Sunday/Wednesday. They did not have a paid pastor, paid staff, or parsonage. They did not pay tithes, nor take up offerings for themselves.

well now, who were they writing the epistles to? the apostles were bishops to all the churches who followed their teachings of Christ. paul worked as a tent maker for his survival but the churches had offerings as do the missionaries of this day and time live and spread the word on.if the churches didnt give ties or offering what was all that with anninias when he got into trouble? where did all that money go? did they spread the word with it? did the apostles use a portion of it to travel with the word?did the bible say that the workman is worthy of his wage? do you beleive that a preacher is not worthy of his wage?i dont limit myself to social services either. i go in the word all the time, learning, praying and worshiping.(in my own way of course)


No where in the epistles is there any commandment to tithe. No where in the espistles is there any re-establishment of the congregation supported priesthood. Sure saints supported Paul's journeys with money and food. Nothing wrong with that. They were not commanded to support or be cursed, though.

History shows there was no record of tithes or church buildings until the 4th century. Such practices fell into vogue after the council of nicea, and we know what happened there. Annanias got into trouble because he chose to sell his land and give ALL the proceeds to the church, to meet the needs of everybody. He died because he changed his mind and wanted to keep SOME of it. He lied about the selling price and God killed him. Had nothing to do with tithes or mandated offerings for the ministry. All NT giving is freewill, including domestic and foreign. If a congregation chooses to support someone with a salary, that's fine because it's freewill. Otherwise, the ministry should support itself like Paul; working in a profession and not placing the saints back under the curse.  Biblical truth teaches this.


We do all those things, even though the Bible and Apostles teach differently. Are we in truth?

i dont see anything different other than modern tech.


Ever seriously looked into the subject? There is a difference.


The Bible definition of Apostolic Truth Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone, and a cornerstone is a finished product for exact emulation - shouldn't Jesus' teachings/words/example be our mirror?

You've posted some great beginning scriptures. Where are the words of Jesus in there? I know we can't post the entire Bible, but it looks like a stronger leaning on the students, rather than the Master. More Apostolic than Bible.

are you suggesting that the apostles were antichrist? were the apostles not teaching the very word of Christ? as far as i can see and read what they teach  fits like a glove to what Jesus taught. we lean on no man but the scripture is used as a good proof.


No I'm not suggesting anything like that. The question is our teaching, not theirs. IF Apostolic truth follows exactly what the Apostles taught, why do we teach things they did not? Why do we get defensive over Jesus' terminology regarding Himself and His Father? Why is Acts 2:38 "the plan of salvation" and not the cross? Why is Apostolic doctrine superior to any other denominal doctrine?

My contention is nothing less than Apostolic truth is not really different than any other denominations truth. All reject anyone who doesn't follow "their truth", even though all first come thru the cross. We must all forget about "our truth" and focus on biblical truth. Otherwise, we remain with 3000+ denominations formed from the same Bible and believing on the same Jesus. Somehow the religion has got to stop and we allow the HG to make us one in Him.


Beleive it or be lost.          dido

You used this phrase a lot. I take it to be applying to Apostolic truth. Our history is not one of great confidence in one another.

well its best to not have confidence in those who prove themselves wrong.you know, the double minded man and all.


Again, I'm wrong for apparently not seeing things your way. How self-righteous is that?


Therefore, is this statement personal, biblical, or universal among followers of Apostolic truth?

if they follow the bible it is universal!!


So acknowledged Apostolics can also be "wrong and double-minded" unless believing exactly alike? Sounds personal to me.


That's all the time I have right now. Thank you for participating. I look forward to continuing later.
okiedokie!!   -yo       

Looking forward to it.