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Warning Controversial!!! Have we missed something?

Started by taco_harvell, October 16, 2013, 05:20:15 PM

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taco_harvell

Have we missed something?

I am in no way here to debate Acts 2:38 as the one and only biblical plan of salvation. I believe it, I love it, I teach it, and I preach it.

I find myself wondering though if maybe in some ways we have built such a shrine on the one scripture that we have missed something.

Let me explain; I rejoice when I hear 100 got the HG and 78 Baptized in Jesus name in one service. But I find myself mourning when I ask later how many are still with us. It almost feels like many in the Apostolic movement are so obsessed with the beginning of the journey they forgot there is still a journey. I even heard someone say "Fulfill Acts 2:38 and that's it your done".

I am tired of hearing huge numbers who get a one time experience but never gain a relationship and walk with God. Would you want to watch a race where they dropped the green flag and immediately dropped the checkered flag to end the race? That's what I am seeing with some who get a onetime experience.

We have to begin to focus on the journey Jesus commanded us to make Disciples not just create experiences. I want the world to experience Acts 2:38  salvation but I also want them to finish the race and make it to heaven. I don't want to be known as a numbers man who gets large numbers of people who get an experience, I want to make sure those who get the experience stay on the journey and actually make it.

I am tired of our focus being so heavy on those who start. I want to make sure they FINISH as well. I rejoice at the start I weep over all those I hear about who don't finish the first lap.

Am I the only one feeling this way? Am I wrong?
In love with RainbowJingles

http://lessonsintrust.blogspot.com/

Scott

What is missing in most churches are two simple things.

1.) Follow Up

2.) New Convert Mentoring

Your follow up can be as simple as a letter, card or phone call and as personal as a knock on the door.  But follow up.

You need to mentor them. At our church I've been teaching the New Members Class and we retain far more people who have attended that class than not.

When someone has come to church 3 times in a row, I ask them to join the class. We have fun talking about the bible, laughing, sharing our lives and problems - all while learning what we believe and teach.  I have members in the class who bring friends and make them attend the class with them. We've had 5 or 6 get baptized and maybe a few more get the Holy Ghost out of our class.

The class cannot be just teaching, but sharing and allowing them to talk. I tell them about my mistakes, problems and faults and what I do to overcome.  We don't shove standards down their throats - we get them built on a foundation and after they have the Holy Ghost and Baptized in Jesus Name.. we find something for them to do. Cleaning Team, Serving Team, Out Reach, Lawn Care, Greeting Team, take an offering,  something! Get them involved. 

We keep so many - I dare say 40% of our church attended that class.

"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle

mini

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I wonder if we made a wax figure of Mini, and then melted it, if we'd get Roscoe... -MellerYeller

Lynx

All I know is, it took me three years of going to church before I was baptized.  But when I did get baptized I knew exactly what it was and why I wanted it, and when I got the Holy Ghost I knew what it was and why I wanted it. 


That was three years of listening though, in Sunday School, to the pastor, to the assistant pastor (which is really quite different - our pastor is better at exhortation, while our assistant pastor is better at edification) to testimonies, reading the Bible, searching out things I had questions about. 
"Do you sing at church?"
"Yes I sing at church, I sing at home, at work, in the car, at the supermarket, at Wal-Mart..."
:sing: :sing: :sing: :sing: :sing: :sing:

Scott

Quote from: Psalm_97 on October 16, 2013, 08:47:45 PM
All I know is, it took me three years of going to church before I was baptized.  But when I did get baptized I knew exactly what it was and why I wanted it, and when I got the Holy Ghost I knew what it was and why I wanted it. 


That was three years of listening though, in Sunday School, to the pastor, to the assistant pastor (which is really quite different - our pastor is better at exhortation, while our assistant pastor is better at edification) to testimonies, reading the Bible, searching out things I had questions about.

This is why I push a ''new member'' class.  Ours is 12 weeks and we will be having a part II later in the year. But it is such a huge help. My newbies have become family.   I am always getting hugs from them.
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle

Roscoe

 This is why I am somewhat happy with our newest folks. They are taking their time and LISTENING. Getting roots. I've saw folks run in, get the Holy Ghost and Baptized, and disappear three months later...which hurts them, and crushes the church's faith. But it seems when they take their time, and are discipled, they stick around. While we don't have a "new member" class- our church is very small, around 30 on a good service counting the kiddos, we go out of our way to set up bible studies, ect for them....For instance, one of our newest members is coming from a trinitarian background. After hearing some preaching that touched on the One God message, she came up to the minister that preached the message and asked him to explain a little better- Pastor overheard it, and now the whole church is getting a refresher on the Godhead. I've heard some older saints express their appreciation for the renewed knowledge too...
Potstirrer and snoop extraordinaire   "I have friends in overalls whose friendship I would not swap for the favor of the kings of the world."- Thomas Edison

clark thompson

Discipleship is often ignored or done to fast. The focus more on winning people to the Lord than keeping them to the Lord.
The Lord made a Way.

Scott

I  cannot stress enough the need for at least a 12 lesson new converts class.

"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle

taco_harvell

Quote from: clark thompson on October 17, 2013, 02:06:07 AM
Discipleship is often ignored or done to fast. The focus more on winning people to the Lord than keeping them to the Lord.
The problem is we aren't "winning" them we are introducing them to the starting line and not making sure they see the rest of the course.
In love with RainbowJingles

http://lessonsintrust.blogspot.com/

Scott

Here is what I teach our new members

1.) The Basics of Salvation
2.) The Bible
3.) Repentance
4.) Baptism in Jesus Name
5.) Receiving the Holy Ghost
6.) Prayer
7.) Spiritual Battles
8.) Biblical Stewardship (not just about money)
9.) Evangelism
10.) Your Pastor and Ministry Team (Let them know who the ministers and leadership are) and your relationship with them
11.) Carrying the Load - the church is here for you! You are not alone. We need you, you need us. Together we are the church
12.) Getting involved in the work of God and how do I become a member of the church.
______________________________________________________________________________

This weekend, a new convert will be singing in our All Nations Sunday, one recent New Convert has been training with the music team to be a praise singer, another 3 new converts cleaned the church last week, top to bottom, fore and aft. Another new convert is starting an addiction ministry and several others are bringing new people to church. One man does out reach to the homeless while another cooks for the church once a month.

We get them prayed through, baptized, trained and involved.
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle

Scott

Quote from: taco_harvell on October 17, 2013, 03:29:01 AM
Quote from: clark thompson on October 17, 2013, 02:06:07 AM
Discipleship is often ignored or done to fast. The focus more on winning people to the Lord than keeping them to the Lord.
The problem is we aren't "winning" them we are introducing them to the starting line and not making sure they see the rest of the course.

Let me change that quote

QuoteThe problem is we aren't too many churches are not "winning" them we they are introducing them to the starting line and not making sure they see the rest of the course.

There are churches who are training them. 
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle

taco_harvell

Quote from: Scott on October 17, 2013, 05:01:27 AM
Quote from: taco_harvell on October 17, 2013, 03:29:01 AM
Quote from: clark thompson on October 17, 2013, 02:06:07 AM
Discipleship is often ignored or done to fast. The focus more on winning people to the Lord than keeping them to the Lord.
The problem is we aren't "winning" them we are introducing them to the starting line and not making sure they see the rest of the course.

Let me change that quote

QuoteThe problem is we aren't too many churches are not "winning" them we they are introducing them to the starting line and not making sure they see the rest of the course.

There are churches who are training them. 
:thumbsup2:
In love with RainbowJingles

http://lessonsintrust.blogspot.com/

taco_harvell

I am just tired of seeing so many get nothing more than an experience and totally missing out on the relationship. The night  I got saved was amazing, but there is so much more since then that makes me love HIM even more.

I want to see them to be able to say they know HIM not that they met Him once. I want to see relationships being built and cultivated. I want to let them know as amazing as Acts 2:38 is keep going because it gets even better!!!
In love with RainbowJingles

http://lessonsintrust.blogspot.com/

Lynx

"I keep falling in love with him
over and over and
over and over again
it gets sweeter and sweeter as the days go by
oh what a love between my Lord and I..."
"Do you sing at church?"
"Yes I sing at church, I sing at home, at work, in the car, at the supermarket, at Wal-Mart..."
:sing: :sing: :sing: :sing: :sing: :sing:

taco_harvell

Quote from: Psalm_97 on October 17, 2013, 04:58:07 PM
"I keep falling in love with him
over and over and
over and over again
it gets sweeter and sweeter as the days go by
oh what a love between my Lord and I..."
:great:
In love with RainbowJingles

http://lessonsintrust.blogspot.com/

Scott

Too many just assume that people will be assimilated by attending church and watching others; then the pastor has a ''saints'' meeting twice a year to lay down the law.

We Preach Acts 2:38 & 39 but fully ignore verse 42 ''And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers.''

Hanging out, eating together, praying together, learning the word together....
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle

Tsalagi

QuoteThe problem is we aren't "winning" them we are introducing them to the starting line and not making sure they see the rest of the course.

This thread is interesting; I'd say one cannot win a friend simply by introducing oneself to them - one must "show themselves friendly". 

Quote from: Scott on October 17, 2013, 11:14:48 PM
Too many just assume that people will be assimilated by attending church and watching others; then the pastor has a ''saints'' meeting twice a year to lay down the law.

We Preach Acts 2:38 & 39 but fully ignore verse 42 ''And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers.''

Hanging out, eating together, praying together, learning the word together....

:great:

Scott

I was proud of one of my Newbies. She is hispanic and at the International service this past weekend, she sang in Spanish and then took my camera and too pictures of everyone at the dinner afterwards.
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." (Vader)

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf (Orwell and Churchhill)


The Never Ending Battle