Everyone needs to read this article. It is for real. Please share with everyone you know, especially pastors and ministers, and hopefully, the church can be notified of the infiltrators.
http://www.charismanews.com/opinion/watchman-on-the-wall/41696-wolves-in-sheep
The person in question is a former Oneness Pentecostal who, along with an associate, is hiding in a local church with an openly admitted plan to cause havoc and discord.
Here is proof:
http://findingdoubt.com/the-wolves-in-sheeps-clothing-project/
:copcar:
Board Rules
6) While this board is not sponsored by or supported by any specific orginazation. This board is not to be used as a platform to openly criticize or bash ANY Apostolic Pentecostal Church, Organization, its beliefs or its leaders.
Let's avoid naming names or trying to create conflict.
:copcar:
I don't see how he could possibly be successful. Wouldn't we discern that bitter spirit and faux zeal? Wouldn't his anger with his own personal baggage come through when talking of real matters of the heart?
And then, What other alternative is there than to just love them? Wouldn't that be an eternal testimony against them? They might say they fooled Pentecostals but they can't really know for sure that we simply didn't love them anyway with hope. Love hopes all things.
I don't think it'll work as they envisioned. At least One of them will be converted solidly. Because God always gets the glory.
Is that his real hair? Lol
Two words: wheat, tares.
Also what mellowyellow said. :cool:
People have tried this for years. They usually get found out. There are too many hoops to jump through to get into church leadership or even into the ministry.
There is no need to panic, worry or start a Sen. McCarthy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism)style ''Witch Hunt''.
...and, it ain't gonna happen here.
One of the wolves posted this in the comments at Charisma:
"it would be good if you corrected your misinformation that this is a Oneness Pentecostal church."
Of course, this doesn't mean that they haven't been to a Oneness church or that they won't go to one in the future. I haven't been to their website and I don't want to.
I went to their site. I read a few blog posts. And I posted. :) I don't mind stirring the pot at all. And it may be pearls before the swine but I can't help but wonder about the other guy. Who I get the faint impression is his "partner."
My post was basically that at the end of the day, he's not discrediting a religion, he's exploiting people. Real people who may be investing in him right now. People that really want to befriend him. Love hopes all things, even when there's discernment. Discretion, faith, grace, is not the absence of discernment. If he's not REALLY getting involved in this church by relationships, he's not going to get much out of this at all. If he is, I have high hopes in the presence of God. Either for him or the other guy.
I took a look at the site. Standard troll fare. We get them all the time in chat.
Problem is, they have elevated confirmation bias to an art form. Anything a christian does will confirm to them that they are right, christianity is fake. Basically they already know what they choose to believe, and twist facts to support their theories instead of vice versa. If we argue with them, they refuse to believe anything we might bring up as proof. If we drop-kick them (ban them from chat) "Hehe, they kicked us out 'cause they couldn't stand to hear the truth." And etcetera.
We have a saying in chat: "Please do not feed the trolls."
I was hoping to protect a brother and pastor in the Lord, and so, shared that information here, thinking that maybe, someone here might personally know said brother and pastor and care enough, to reach out to him and give him a head's up because he and his church is in potential danger.
Guess I was wrong.
Quote from: Raven180 on December 06, 2013, 07:18:40 AM
I was hoping to protect a brother and pastor in the Lord, and so, shared that information here, thinking that maybe, someone here might personally know said brother and pastor and care enough, to reach out to him and give him a head's up because he and his church is in potential danger.
Guess I was wrong.
We just don't operate that way here. Good intention or not - we cannot allow GP to become a place where fingers are pointed, names are called and potential church trouble is stirred up. I've seen this type of thing happen before and someone got a bad reputation due to an incorrect assumption that led to a false accusation.
We want to avoid bearing False Witness and Gossiping. Gossip is wrong, even if it is true.
These ''wolves'' come around from time to time and most churches have had to deal with them. The best thing to do is just pray for the situation.
Another thing to add and please do not take this wrong.
How can we trust what you say? To the best of my knowledge, no one here has vouched for you personally and we have no idea if you are male, female, how old you are and what your experience in the Church is.
It is the anonymity of the internet and these discussion boards that prevent us from allowing this type of conversation that I had to delete.
We have to have rules and they are strict for a reason.
I understand and respect, that Scott.
I didn't see it as stirring up trouble. The links I provided, if read over, prove what I say is true.
My name is Aaron. I am 35. I live in Wisconsin. I attend here: www.rockofjesus.org. I have been an Apostolic Pentecostal for just shy of 11 years.
I know a lot of the ministers in Wisconsin - I am not familiar with your pastor (sorry).
Aaron - the problem with discussion boards is that the anonymity often becomes a breeding ground for trouble.
Over the years that Godplace and before that UPCI.Com and UPCI.WS has been open, we've had people post ''truth" about certain preachers and ''false'' members - that was later found out to be false; some done on purpose and some done based on minimal information. (Look at the weird FB Hoaxes that get passed around for an example)
It became so bad, that we had to institute some very strict rules about this type of thing.
Back to the situation you are concerned about. Rather than post it on GP or FB, why not shoot an email to the pastor in question? Perhaps have your pastor contact him?
Hey, maybe he's from GP? It's public but that was quick and very specific. LOL
Quote
findingdoubt December 6, 2013 at 1:26 am | Reply
Mel, aka mellowyellow? Are you from the forum "godplace"? Just wonderin'. I'm in the middle of school right now so I'll comment more later.
LOL Maaaaybe he's in MY church. :roll:
Nah, he probably just googles his own topic once in a while to see how many times its been posted on forums and Facebook, and found this thread. ;)
Quote from: Psalm_97 on December 06, 2013, 03:18:15 PM
Nah, he probably just googles his own topic once in a while to see how many times its been posted on forums and Facebook, and found this thread. ;)
There is something familiar about his writing style, the syntax seems familiar.
Quote from: Scott on December 06, 2013, 02:14:58 PM
I know a lot of the ministers in Wisconsin - I am not familiar with your pastor (sorry).
Aaron - the problem with discussion boards is that the anonymity often becomes a breeding ground for trouble.
Over the years that Godplace and before that UPCI.Com and UPCI.WS has been open, we've had people post ''truth" about certain preachers and ''false'' members - that was later found out to be false; some done on purpose and some done based on minimal information. (Look at the weird FB Hoaxes that get passed around for an example)
It became so bad, that we had to institute some very strict rules about this type of thing.
Back to the situation you are concerned about. Rather than post it on GP or FB, why not shoot an email to the pastor in question? Perhaps have your pastor contact him?
As the admin, I know you have the right to enforce as you see fit, no matter how much I may agree or not. No hard feelings. Do what you have to do to protect the board and those involved.
The pastor in question has been contacted. He knows who the "wolf" is personally, and is making the various churches in the area aware of his possible presence.
I'm glad he knows about it.
Wow. I went back there to read MellowYellow's post and it took my phone four minutes to load the whole page. Comment overload!
A troll usually has two objectives - First, to cause trouble and second, to get attention. Judging from this guy's comment page he at least achieved the secondary objective.
Leave it to someone of ill intent to advertise their plot and thus be found out. Lol.
I tell my kids there really are no evil geniuses. In the end, their own evilness trips them up.
We've been trolled many times over the years and have had trolls try to cause problems for various churches. People angry at a particular preacher or church and wanting to call them out on the board. Some were legit many were not.
The problem is that for the largest majority of us, we have no way to verify - so we stay out of it and remain neutral.
Out of morbid curiosity I checked that site to read his reply he promised he would make to mellowyellow's post. Apparently he has decided he has better things to do and has moved on. His site now is labeled "ivedecidedmytimeisbetterspentdoingsomethingelse | courtesyofalatenightconvo"
Pity. I was kind of interested how he would respond.
I suspect that he was a current or former member of GP and when Mel posted there, he realized he could be outed if more GP people showed up.
Something in his writing style rang a bell. I've read a lot of posts over the year running this thing.
Wow. What a turn of events.
There is a post over at Apostolic Friends Forum where he gives more details as to why he quit the subterfuge. It's called "Everyone needs to read this now". It's open to the non-registered public and can be found in the section called Fellowship Hall. His screen name is livefortruth.
Yeah... I looked through AFF and had to leave. I just cannot stand the combative nature over there.
Quote from: Scott on December 10, 2013, 05:53:57 PM
Yeah... I looked through AFF and had to leave. I just cannot stand the combative nature over there.
It can certainly get discouraging and disappointing. There are a few diamonds in the rough, though. It just needs better moderation.
I'm glad to have heard about this whole situation. My glasses aren't so rose colored but neither am I with less hope.
I read the AFF thread and I would like to think he's a step closer to what his soul really longs for. Authentic Christians. But he's gotta get his head/heart wrapped around Grace.
People should take a look at the rules of the board. For each of the rules, there are dozens of stories behind them.
Some are pretty wild.